2013 Rider: Kamen Rider Gaim - News/Rumors thread

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I don't see how much clearer this can be; he seems to think that Riders trying to kill each other for oftentimes inane reasons is somehow natural to the franchise..

The word "Rider" is a bit misleading, but when he said "it's natural for Riders to fight each other", he means it in the way Hopper fights Spider in the original show, Black Sun fights Shadow Moon, ZO fights Doras, Ultimate Kuuga fights N Daguba Zeba, W fights Eternal, PuToTyra fights Maki Greeed, the list goes on and on.

One of the core ideas of Kamen Rider is that the Rider's powers are the powers of the very evil that they fight, and the only thing that separates them is what they decided to use those powers for. On that point, Urobuchi is on the money on what Kamen Rider is as an idea.
 
Both of you need to cool it. No need for this anywhere in the forums.
You read that wrong. There was no hostility in that. He knows he's obsessed.

I believe Urobuchi's view on Rider vs Rider is wrong, but with very valid reasons. Using the Shocker Rider battles as comparison shows how much he doesn't get it, but at the same time how much he has a point.
That's what I'm talking about. A view is an opinion. It can't be wrong. If every writer viewed Kamen Rider the same way the series would be stale by now. You guys are all saying he doesn't get it but if any of you started describing your "view" of Kamen Rider you'd all be disagreeing with each other.
 
I don't see how much clearer this can be; he seems to think that Riders trying to kill each other for oftentimes inane reasons is somehow natural to the franchise..

No, because he said that he decided not to make them all freinds because he liked ryuki, and that series has the aspect of the rider battle. He didn't say "Everybody in gaim hates eachother because thats how it is in all kamen riders". I'm being a dick right now, pointing all this **** out, but you're sorta being pretty arrogant too soooo...... Idk, Lets just grab onto space and coooool out. Murder me and then I can forgive you or something. :patriotic: <-on the moon
 
Honestly I did kinda like Ryuki when I watched it, so if Urobuchi can manage to pull off another Ryuki, but with an endgame that doesn't suck, I think I'll be okay with it.
 
So Ryuki is what Kamen Rider is to you? Nothing wrong with that, but I don't think that's really what Kamen Rider as a whole is about, and it looks like Urobuchi might not understand that either.
Well, apart from being biased due to growing up with Ryuki, I do believe Ryuki wasn't such a big step away from the typical Rider format people think it is.

In the original Kamen Rider, Hongo Takeshi and Ichimonji Hayato were the only cyborgs to fight for justice because they escaped the brain-washing process. The rest of the cyborg soldiers were built the same, trained the same etc. That makes them pretty much just like the Kamen Riders themselves right?

The thing about (almost) every Kamen Rider series is that the source of origin for both the heroes and villains are the same, it is just up to the user to decide whether to fight for justice or chaos.

I feel Kamen Rider Ryuki just attacked this concept differently. Instead of Riders JUST fighting monsters created by a central villain or organization, they fight each other. All of the Riders in the series gain their powers from a single source, who isn't quite a good guy. They then decide whether or not to use their powers for their own ambitions or fun (Gai, Ouja, pretty much every rider in Ryuki) or to actually use it to save others (Ryuki, Raia).

And with this we get a lot of drama and dilemmas but the theme is clearly there - Using power to fight for humanity or using it for "evil". Having antagonist Riders in Ryuki was pretty much the equivalent to villains of the week. Instead of monsters, we have Riders, and I believe Urobuchi is saying that despite the title of "Rider", they are the equivalent of monsters.

This is something that hasn't been done since Ryuki, since every Rider battle afterwards has been because of misunderstandings or the evil Rider is actually a monster (or they are just dicks like Kaixa). I feel like Urobuchi wants to try the Ryuki approach again by making the Riders the equivalent of the actual monsters.
 
That's what I'm talking about. A view is an opinion. It can't be wrong. If every writer viewed Kamen Rider the same way the series would be stale by now. You guys are all saying he doesn't get it but if any of you started describing your "view" of Kamen Rider you'd all be disagreeing with each other.
I thought he missed the point of the Shocker Riders, which was to show a monstruous version of the not-so-monstruous Rider 1. Comparing the Double Riders to them shows how much they are NOT monsters by facing what they would have been...

But at the same time, they both have the same powers and it's just a different user, so essentially it is facing themselves, and in a way as similar to Ryuki vs Ohja, Faiz vs Kaixa, etc.

I agree and disagree with him, I think he's wrong and right. I... can't elaborate this any further.
 

I see, thanks for that.

No, because he said that he decided not to make them all freinds because he liked ryuki, and that series has the aspect of the rider battle. He didn't say "Everybody in gaim hates eachother because thats how it is in all kamen riders". I'm being a dick right now, pointing all this **** out, but you're sorta being pretty arrogant too

Sorry, I didn't mean to come off as arrogant.. it's just that we had finally gotten "Kamen Rider" to be a respected term again and not just something any ol'bozo could call themselves when they put on a suit.

I was just worried that Urobuchi was gonna throw that all away, (again).
 
Besides, "Kamen Rider is deeply meaningful" always felt like Tsukada's thing to me. I wouldn't expect it to show up in projects where he wasn't involved.
 
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