Kamen Rider Gaim Ep 33 - "The Great Beat Riders' Gathering!"

[Black Fang]

Gaim 33:

- Well that was sudden of you, Akira. Just leaving a note for your brother to find instead of leaving with him? And don't leave your suitcase behind like that! I hate it when stuff like that happens.

- How is it that native English speakers always seem to overact in these shows?

- It would be interesting to see how Shotaro, Phillip, Ryu, Eiji, the two Births, and the Kamen Rider Club would react to this breaking news of exposed conspiracy. It would also be funny if Kougami was involved somehow.

- Kaito sneering at Mai's plan for no reason other than "I'm the aloof jerk character" :redface2:

- I wouldn't mind one-shot Overlords if we had seen them or knew they existed earlier. It seemed that as far as the show was concerned, only three Overlords were around.

- That deer Invess has different horns than the one in episode 2.

- That wasn't a perfect circle! Mai drew the end point at a diagonal! :shakefist

- I've noticed that Kouta's leather jacket makes him look older and more mature. Compare that to his earlier "kid" apparel.

- Is it weird that Tomohisa Yuge looks older in Ryuki than he does in Gaim?

Don't worry about him, Kouta. He has plenty of experience facing otherworldly monsters. :thumbs:

- I wonder if the term 'Kamen Rider' will ever be said in reference to Kouta.

- Mai suddenly reminds me of the person on the other end of the codec in the Metal Gear Solid games.

- Ok, for all the fuss people are making about Minato's line about Kaito... now that I hear it, it comes off more like she's satisfying a personal curiosity rather than wanting to be his lackey "I'm a good guy now!"

- Bravo's random cameo mid-fight was probably funnier than was intended. Though I was expecting something more dramatic given the teaser last week.

- ... And now your pining over Zangetsu ruined the coolness you had this episode, Oren. Nice going. :shakefist

This is irritating me because the impression I'm getting from the show is that Minato's moral worth depends on who she's chosen to follow, so she can't be held responsible for her own actions. She's working for Ryouma, conspires with him against Takatora, is complicit in his plan for genocide and tries to kill Takatora on Ryouma's orders? Of course she's a villain!

Well I'm glad that's established.

But now she's obsessed with Kaito, has "high hopes" for him and is working with him to protect the city he's now decided he cares about? Well that's totally different! Now she's a hero and anything she did before this doesn't matter!

But who is saying that? It doesn't make her a hero more than it just simply shows she's an opportunist. Whomever she can latch onto and get some of that status she will do so. She's a human remora in other words. I don't know why anyone would immediately conclude that she's a good guy now just for sticking with Kaito.

Maybe us fans still hold on to the idea that a Kamen Rider must be a hero that, despite Toei's abuse of the term, we habitually think anyone with the title must be good. To that I might say "Onore Toei!!" for your mental manipulations. >.>

 

[BoukenSilver83]

i watched the subs of this episode: with mai and kaito having a one on one converison, she said it was kaito that brought everyone together and she said that's why and then the crack open and kaito started fighting,

that's something that mai wanted kaito to do, im going to guess she wanted kaito to take over the beat riders if something happened to her.


because it's something that kota didnt want to hear because he's been worried and protecting her all the time and he didnt want to overreact.

i think mai knows something is going to happen to her or something she discovered and doesnt want to tell kota. even alt mai was warning her about her fate with kota.

so something is going to happen with mai that kota doesnt want to know.

 

[CannibalS]

That's fair enough ... although on a personal level I find it hard to distinguish how much of that is Gaim and its staff, vs how much is the general trend for recent Rider series to cast younger and younger girls to appeal to the male gaze, and basically have the female leads be there to look cute and act as the hero's emotional support (also Toei has gone in for the "woman as plot device/McGuffin" thing a few times lately)

That's definately been going on since Decade, though this is so far the worst instance of this trend I'd say.
Like Koyomi was described as "a doll", but you could atleast argue her being one and pulled around by the male characters is treated as a bad thing in the show, and the conclusion was how she should be allowed to have peace.

 

[lazycoconut]

But who is saying that? It doesn't make her a hero more than it just simply shows she's an opportunist. Whomever she can latch onto and get some of that status she will do so. She's a human remora in other words. I don't know why anyone would immediately conclude that she's a good guy now just for sticking with Kaito.

Maybe us fans still hold on to the idea that a Kamen Rider must be a hero that, despite Toei's abuse of the term, we habitually think anyone with the title must be good. To that I might say "Onore Toei!!" for your mental manipulations. >.>

I wouldn't call that the case and I don't think anyone watching this show believes it (Sid wasn't a good guy, and neither are Ryouma or Micchi.) But with the way Minato's character is presented so far, I feel like the show basically expects me to forget everything she's done in the past and take it for granted that she is good based on her support for Kaito.

i watched the subs of this episode: with mai and kaito having a one on one converison, she said it was kaito that brought everyone together and she said that's why and then the crack open and kaito started fighting,

that's something that mai wanted kaito to do, im going to guess she wanted kaito to take over the beat riders if something happened to her.


because it's something that kota didnt want to hear because he's been worried and protecting her all the time and he didnt want to overreact.

i think mai knows something is going to happen to her or something she discovered and doesnt want to tell kota. even alt mai was warning her about her fate with kota.

so something is going to happen with mai that kota doesnt want to know.

But Kaito quit the Beat Riders just like Kouta. At a pinch I'd say she was going to ask him to help to rebuild Zawame or bring the people back together if she can't (she and Kaito initially bonded over them both hating Yggdrasill for destroying the city they loved, so now that she knows he really does care about Zawame's people, that would be the opportune moment to ask him.)

Alt-Mai told her to avoid Kouta and Kaito because they would lead her to ruin. Mai would not trust Kaito if she were taking Alt-Mai's words to heart. If she's worried about something happening to her it may well be to do with the Sagara incident

That's definately been going on since Decade, though this is so far the worst instance of this trend I'd say.
Like Koyomi was described as "a doll", but you could atleast argue her being one and pulled around by the male characters is treated as a bad thing in the show, and the conclusion was how she should be allowed to have peace.

She at least got to call Fueki out on it. Mai has been allowed to confront Kouta or Kaito over certain things they've done but usually ends up being sympathetic to them. I get annoyed at the perception I've seen around a lot of different sites from people that think that Mai exists or should exist solely to be Kouta's love interest but so far the show has not given her much chance to shine on her own

 

[Yoona]

I wouldn't call that the case and I don't think anyone watching this show believes it (Sid wasn't a good guy, and neither are Ryouma or Micchi.) But with the way Minato's character is presented so far, I feel like the show basically expects me to forget everything she's done in the past and take it for granted that she is good based on her support for Kaito.

Exactly. What I personally feel and what I believe the show is leading me to feel are two different things. My own personal reaction to Youko is mostly irrelevant to this discussion - what I'm focusing on is how I think the show wants me to see her character. I do feel we as viewers are being directed to see her as essentially on the side of the good guys right now. It may not remain that way, but that's how it is currently.

 

[Black Fang]

I wouldn't call that the case and I don't think anyone watching this show believes it (Sid wasn't a good guy, and neither are Ryouma or Micchi.) But with the way Minato's character is presented so far, I feel like the show basically expects me to forget everything she's done in the past and take it for granted that she is good based on her support for Kaito.

Exactly. What I personally feel and what I believe the show is leading me to feel are two different things. My own personal reaction to Youko is mostly irrelevant to this discussion - what I'm focusing on is how I think the show wants me to see her character. I do feel we as viewers are being directed to see her as essentially on the side of the good guys right now. It may not remain that way, but that's how it is currently.

I don't see where you're finding that, though. I certainly didn't get a "Malika is now one of us" impression from this episode. It's just an alliance born out of extenuating circumstances. That Kouta is glad to have her as an ally for the moment is just part of his character. Her speech about power and Kaito to Kouta is frankly more a neutral observation than anything else. It really doesn't seem like all of a sudden she's on Kouta's bandwagon.

 

[Murphy]

I'd also argue that whether Minato is a villain or a hero - and I agree that the show is trying to direct us towards the latter at the moment, and it's a slightly odd turn - her motivations still matter.

Misogynistic writing is skeevy whether it's being applied to a bad guy or a good guy. The fact that she's a bad guy doesn't mitigate the fact that it's frankly bizarre for the show to be heavily implying that her motive is 'wanting to help a powerful man', especially when that's wrapped up in a lot of notions of 'women only do things to advance men's goals', and especially when she's the only female Rider this year.

I really like Minato, she's one of my favourite characters in the show and has been since she was introduced, but I'm vexed at the direction they've taken her in.

 

[Wing Saber]

Yoko doesn't have any ambitions of her own. All she's showed is her blind loyalty to Ryoma, to where she has no problem betraying Takatora when ordered to. It's only when he abandoned her that she felt that loyalty was misplaced and sided with Kaito all because he was able to rally the other Riders together.

 

[lazycoconut]

^ and because she's been flirting with him for weeks, has "higher hopes" for him than for Ryouma, and convinced Ryouma to give him the Lemon Energy Arms upgrade

This is exactly the vibe that I get from the show: that they want me to feel that Minato's morality and actions are determined by whoever she's chosen to follow, so she's not really responsible for them, and nothing she did previously matters now that she is allied with Kaito on the side of justice. Kaito on the other hand has always believed that people should be responsible for themselves, so trusting her with anything important would go against his established character

 

[Black Fang]

Is it really flirting with him or just the ol' "siren" method of encouragement? You make it sound like she would actually want to have something with a kid like Kaito, and I really don't see that.

By that reasoning Sagara is flirting with Kouta because he has "high hopes" for him and keeps giving him gifts.