X-Men 3: The Last Stand - Talkback *Spoilers*

[laudre]

But unlike in X3, Jean didn't just suddenly gain these powers out of nowhere.

She didn't gain them out of nowhere in X3. The first scene in the movie established that she'd had them all along, and that she had difficulty controlling it. Charles used his greater telepathic skill (and power -- I don't think that movie-Jean is a more powerful telepath than Charles, just a godlike telekinetic) to block off the greater portion of her powers, to keep them to a level where she could control them properly. Remember, even the weakened powers she had in the first two movies she'd had to learn how to control. Her manifesting signs of the Phoenix at the end of X2 was out of her desperate need for the full scope of her power.

Like I said before, the split-personality crap was dumb as hell. If the Phoenix Force had possessed Jean or just replicated her, it would've made sense.

... Okay, you lost me. How does a poorly-explained cosmic entity make more sense than Jean's overwhelming power causing her mind to fragment in frustration at the limitations Charles placed on it?

I loathe reading about the main-line Marvel universe version of the Phoenix Saga, because it's an impenetrable mess. Give me any other version of Phoenix story -- X-Men: TAS with its godawful animation and hideous art style, X-Men Evolution, Ultimate X-Men (gasp! a continuity I can follow!), or X-movies, but don't make me try to untangle the main one.

 

[Skyknight]

Like I said before, the split-personality crap was dumb as hell. If the Phoenix Force had possessed Jean or just replicated her, it would've made sense.

Dude...you just don't get it, and I honestly think you're deliberatly ignoring every defense made about the plot twist just to cry and whine that you did'nt get your precious 616 version which was'nt that reallistic or good to begin with. Am I bashing the Dark Phoenix storyline that followed? No, am I bashing the "it came from the stars and gave Marvel an excuse to introduce a bunch of Star Wars rejects?" Yes.

The Phoenix Force always works better as a secondary and heigtened stage of mutation, and heck, she did'nt get them "out of nowhere", it was hinted at in X-2, this was the natural manifestation of that obvious mutation, and it clearly broke down the mental blocks that were harbouring Jean's darker side, giving us a quick, easy, and reallistic approach to a corrupted and dangerous mutant.

It's sad when the least negative aspect of the movie, and one of the more original ways of quickly setting up a corrupted hero is scolded at for not following an origin that was dumb to begin with. But hey, that's nerds

 

[Shougo B'Stard]

It's sad when the least negative aspect of the movie, and one of the more original ways of quickly setting up a corrupted hero is scolded at for not following an origin that was dumb to begin with. But hey, that's nerds

It's sad when these movies try to take a "realistic" approach when they're comic book movies..! As long as you have a naked lizard lady who can change into everyone, you're already unbelievable, you might as well go that extra step and introduce something as nutty as the Phoenix force (which, for most of the movie, Jean did act like she was possessed, in a bad Emily Rose-esque way, not that it was her suppressed bratty personality). I'm not a fan of the Phoenix storyline, so that didn't matter to me...what did matter to me is the horrible way they've handled Scott and Jean throughout this series, but hey...

I've always thought these movies were X-Men Lite, anyhow. They always seemed to be ashamed of being a superhero movie. Scott being reduced to tenth-fiddle and Jean's jumping the couch worked for these movies. They're all right and fun as popcorn fare, but if you've read an X-Men comic of any sort, I do find that you have to toss out a lot of what you know about the comics to enjoy them and overlook a lot of flaws and plotholes.

 

[Sage Shinigami]

Dude...you just don't get it, and I honestly think you're deliberatly ignoring every defense made about the plot twist just to cry and whine that you did'nt get your precious 616 version which was'nt that reallistic or good to begin with. Am I bashing the Dark Phoenix storyline that followed? No, am I bashing the "it came from the stars and gave Marvel an excuse to introduce a bunch of Star Wars rejects?" Yes.

The Phoenix Force always works better as a secondary and heigtened stage of mutation, and heck, she did'nt get them "out of nowhere", it was hinted at in X-2, this was the natural manifestation of that obvious mutation, and it clearly broke down the mental blocks that were harbouring Jean's darker side, giving us a quick, easy, and reallistic approach to a corrupted and dangerous mutant.

It's sad when the least negative aspect of the movie, and one of the more original ways of quickly setting up a corrupted hero is scolded at for not following an origin that was dumb to begin with. But hey, that's nerds

The Phoenix Force works better as a mutation? Godlike power works best as a mutation? HOW? Even Magneto's, "I'm in touch with the magnetic poles of the Earth" is more realistic. I don't see how you guys can eat up Mark Millar's bullshit "Ultimate" explanation of "super puberty" over a cosmic being. All of the other mutants are nowhere near as powerful, but somehow Jean wins the mutant lotto?

 

[Bolt]

 

[Mega Ranger]

The Phoenix Force works better as a mutation? Godlike power works best as a mutation? HOW? Even Magneto's, "I'm in touch with the magnetic poles of the Earth" is more realistic. I don't see how you guys can eat up Mark Millar's bullshit "Ultimate" explanation of "super puberty" over a cosmic being. All of the other mutants are nowhere near as powerful, but somehow Jean wins the mutant lotto?

Jeans always been the most powerful mutant. in any continuity. As for Millar, we're alls till waiting for the TRUE explanation of the phoenix force in Millars continuity.

 

[Sage Shinigami]

Jeans always been the most powerful mutant. in any continuity. As for Millar, we're alls till waiting for the TRUE explanation of the phoenix force in Millars continuity.

Yes, but she's never been at galactic threat-level. She can be the most powerful without being anywhere near that level.

The True explanation? Mutant puberty was it, I thought.

 

[Ragna "D" BloodEdge]

There's only a handful of Omega-Level mutants in Marvel besides Jean who have the whole infinite potential thing going on. There's Rachel, Jean's daughter, who also hosted the Phoenix Force, Iceman, Quentin Quire(Kid Omega), Franklin Richards, Elixir, Mister M, and Vulcan. Jean's secondary mutation in Here Comes Tomorrow may or may not apply now since she asborbed that timeline into the White Hot Room, but it wouldn't surprise me if it still did considering the power she has now.

 

[Judge Faiz]

I just saw X3 and I really enjoyed it.
Only parts I found fault w/ is Colossus did NOT have a Russian accent. And when Juggernaut is not a mutant. His power is magical, so he shouldn't have been effected by Leaches power and also probably should have recognised Chuck...since their half brother's and all.

But eh..what ya gonna do...it's a Xmen flick.

-RF

 

[laudre]

Only parts I found fault w/ is Colossus did NOT have a Russian accent.

He didn't have one in X2, either. I don't know why, other than perhaps the actor couldn't do a decent one. Or they just didn't bother, since he's had one line per movie so far.

And when Juggernaut is not a mutant. His power is magical, so he shouldn't have been effected by Leaches power and also probably should have recognised Chuck...since their half brother's and all.

Obviously, neither of these things is true in movie continuity. Making Juggernaut (or anyone else with powers in the movies) something other than a mutant would complicate the movie's cosmology WAY too much -- having to add and explain the Juggernaut's powers would bog the movie down immensely, never mind the grotesque distortion the Phoenix Force would add. Both Phoenix and Juggernaut are X-Men characters; making the source for their powers anything other than mutation is needlessly complicated.

If I'm gonna take issue with anything, it's the throwaway usage of a LOT of great characters, like Callisto and Psylocke (I didn't even know Psylocke was in the movie until I saw something about it on IMDb -- which one was she?). Hell, according to IMDb, Omega Freaking Red is in the movie -- where was he?