X-Men 3: The Last Stand - Talkback *Spoilers*

[Skyknight]

This film was solid and proved Ratner can stick to Singers' version without going on his own direction. The script raised great points, more of a "cival dispute" than a side taking clash of speicies, too bad the style took over from the substance after the second major death, and did'nt resume with the story, or any kind of con

Whoever wrote this movie could'nt really keep a straight balance. The action scenes were still good, but felt out of place due to how the script played out the characters and setting. It should have been called something other than "The Last Stand", more like "Fate of the Future". But then, it's difficult enough to keep [HIDE]James Marsden as Cyclops[/HIDE] under contract for FIVE MINUTES as opposed to two and a half hours.

Too many characters were sidelined, the new characters also got suprisingly screwed in places also. Oh and one other thing

[HIDE]Class-Five Mutants can't beat Hugh Jackman[/HIDE]

 

[Ragna "D" BloodEdge]

Well...the movie itself was solid enough, but just like I was afraid of, Jean was completely and totally mishandled as the Phoenix. No cosmic powers, no awe-inspiring celestial firebird--nothing even close--just making her a split-personality case and going around de-molecularizing people. If you're not gonna make Jean Phoenix in fact as well as in name, DON'T USE HER. :shakefist

 

[Doggy Kruger]

I think they really had no choice since they already set the stage in the end of X2.

 

[Ragna "D" BloodEdge]

That's exactly what I mean--they were leaning so far toward it in X-2 with the flaming energy Jean was using and the glimpse of the Phoenix itself at the bottom of Lake Alkalai, and then X3 comes along and just deep-sixes a perfect setup.

 

[Skyknight]

Well...the movie itself was solid enough, but just like I was afraid of, Jean was completely and totally mishandled as the Phoenix. No cosmic powers, no awe-inspiring celestial firebird--nothing even close--just making her a split-personality case and going around de-molecularizing people. If you're not gonna make Jean Phoenix in fact as well as in name, DON'T USE HER. :shakefist

These movies are supposed to be semi reallistic, treating mutantkind on a scientific and political level of realism, the lack of any cosmic powers and giving Jean a split personality was ten times more original than what Chris Claremont ever came up with for Phoenix. X-Men is'nt Star Trek, I don't have a clue what he was smoking when he wrote those storylines. As good as they were, it was'nt X-Men. To this date I still think the first 616 Universe Phoenix origin is one of the most idiotic Marvel still stick with.

X-Men: Evolution also toyed with Jean's Phoenix-like powers being just an upgrade in Jeans' mutation, but they never produced the season where this power manifested itself again

 

[Blackbird]

These movies are supposed to be semi reallistic, treating mutantkind on a scientific and political level of realism, the lack of any cosmic powers and giving Jean a split personality was ten times more original than what Chris Claremont ever came up with for Phoenix. X-Men is'nt Star Trek, I don't have a clue what he was smoking when he wrote those storylines. As good as they were, it was'nt X-Men. To this date I still think the first 616 Universe Phoenix origin is one of the most idiotic Marvel still stick with.

X-Men: Evolution also toyed with Jean's Phoenix-like powers being just an upgrade in Jeans' mutation, but they never produced the season where this power manifested itself again

Yeah, I agree. They'd already said they weren't going to do a cosmic-type thing, or anything dealing with space.

 

[Ragna "D" BloodEdge]

I know they weren't going the whole cosmic route, although I would've dearly loved to have seen the whole M'Kraan Crystal Saga. But to me, Chris Claremont's Phoenix storyline is the definitive version, although he came into conflict with the editors at Marvel during the Dark Phoenix Sage regarding what should've been done with the original plot.

But still...why imply that the Phoenix (Force) was coming by the end of X2 at all if they weren't gonna capitalize on it in X3, new writer or no? It just seems like a big waste.

 

[Blackbird]

I know they weren't going the whole cosmic route, although I would've dearly loved to have seen the whole M'Kraan Crystal Saga. But to me, Chris Claremont's Phoenix storyline is the definitive version, although he came into conflict with the editors at Marvel during the Dark Phoenix Sage regarding what should've been done with the original plot.

Before Jean's return in X-Factor #1, it was assumed that she was the Phoenix. Then some writers (for X-Factor) forgot that Jean was dead, so they had to come up with a way to bring her back.

But still...why imply that the Phoenix (Force) was coming by the end of X2 at all if they weren't gonna capitalize on it in X3, new writer or no? It just seems like a big waste.

They showed the firebird at the end of X2 to leave it open, and to give fans a nod, I think. I never assumed it was going to be about the Phoenix Force, but about Jean's powers evolving.

 

[Ragna "D" BloodEdge]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dark_Phoenix_Saga#Jean_Grey_and_Phoenix_as_separate_entities

 

[Blackbird]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dark_Phoenix_Saga#Jean_Grey_and_Phoenix_as_separate_entities

Yeah, I know all that. There used to be a graphic novel I had called Phoenix: The Untold Story. It was the original story, in which she survives and doesn't die.