Anti-Japanese Protests Heating Up in China

[Shogun_Master]

I agree with Loghorn, but will up it to "this will eventually blow up someone's face"

Someone made a statement earlier as to the general nature of these riots & it just sounds like the Chinese people just have a hell of a lot of residual anger period & the more they're able & willing to express it, the more they're going to pull issues out of the ass &, before you know it, China has a Revolution on it's hands- if it manages to go that far.

And if the idiots allow it to go on too long, they're going to have to come up with a way to channel that anger & contain it, which may end up either forcing their hand into war with Japan- which a lot of people will end up getting into (US included, but god only knows where we'd even go as we're allies with & kinda/ sorta depend on both) or they'll simply crush it & have the conscience of literally forcing millions of people to fall on their swords.

Though, I guess it'd be the latter- the Chinese government is probably furthest from the general Asian stereotype as an Asian could get.

 

[Ziginz Zegell]

I agree with Loghorn, but will up it to "this will eventually blow up someone's face"

Someone made a statement earlier as to the general nature of these riots & it just sounds like the Chinese people just have a hell of a lot of residual anger period & the more they're able & willing to express it, the more they're going to pull issues out of the ass &, before you know it, China has a Revolution on it's hands- if it manages to go that far.

And if the idiots allow it to go on too long, they're going to have to come up with a way to channel that anger & contain it, which may end up either forcing their hand into war with Japan- which a lot of people will end up getting into (US included, but god only knows where we'd even go as we're allies with & kinda/ sorta depend on both) or they'll simply crush it & have the conscience of literally forcing millions of people to fall on their swords.

Though, I guess it'd be the latter- the Chinese government is probably furthest from the general Asian stereotype as an Asian could get.

But there havn't been any military threats yet have there? I mean at this point it is still a political bebate and question of ownership. I doubt a super power would go to war with a smaller nation (albeit as wealthy as it is right now) over an island that may or may not be important in the greater scheme of things.

You also have to think about how many nations are indebted to China right now and the risk, as slight as it is, and I mean slight, of those indebted nations taking the chance to man handle them alongside Japan. Does China really want to risk the U.S., U.K., or Russia standing alongside Japan over what amounts to a pile of rocks? Of course that could lead to China demanding payment for those debts, but that would only further turn them into targets by said various nations. No, China won't fight this one out on the battle field. Japan either, they would give up the islands before that, or give them to another country to deal with before they would get dragged down to hell over the matter. This would be a political battle with some colateral damage and nothing more.

Japan will probably hold out for as long as they can though just to prove a point, as they should. "Your country may be able to eat us alive, but you've never rulled us nor will you ever." But then China has alot of reason to be pissed. Both countries have shown their strength and tenacity before, and I doubt either are ready to sink their teeth into each other. No...they will just stick to growling and the occasional nip in the ass just to remind each other they are still each there.

 

[shingamyeonblack]

Japan doesn't want to mobilize a large amount of soldiers from the mainland. They actually aren't meant to do that.

 

[ParaParaJMo]

Constitutionally, Japan can't really act as an aggressor to war and they officially don't have a military. Yes, they have the self-defense forces, but they are still civilians.

Well, these uneasy relationships have existed for generations, its just this island issue gives an excuse to express the hate to a whole new level. shingamyeonblack talked about dokdo. since i live in japan, i have heard the islands as takeshima. i am aware if the issue gets severe, north korea would side with south korea. can't believe the dispute is that bad.

as for china's territory waters claims, reminds me of the 2001 US spy plane incident that landed in hainan. I remember a James Bond movie (I think Tomorrow Never Dies) where they address China claiming that anything beyond 20 miles or so is their waters.

 

[MetalSymphony]

as for china's territory waters claims, reminds me of the 2001 US spy plane incident that landed in hainan. I remember a James Bond movie (I think Tomorrow Never Dies) where they address China claiming that anything beyond 20 miles or so is their waters.

That was actually the Main villain using a GPS decoder to send a British Warship into Chinese waters, when their own GPS's told them they where far from. Two Chinese MiG's scrambled to harass them into turning around. (The British figured that this was the Chinese claiming all of the ocean unaware they where in their territorial waters).

Then the bad guys Stealth boat both Shunk the Warship and Shot down one of the fighters, making look like the one launched an unprovoked attack on the other. (They also killed all the warship survivors with the same kind of Gun's and ammo the Chinese military uses to further set things up) So England and China almost go to war over this...Until Bond steps in. :coolshades:

 

[Bolt]

I suspect (though as a gwailo I have no real right to do much speculation on this topic) that China's claims to the many islands and interstitial territories in Southeast Asia have much to do with the fact that at one time much of Southeast Asia was encompassed by the Chinese empire, not unlike the manner in which the British held dominion remotely over various and sundry lands the world over around the Victorian era, some having little or nothing to do with England at all.

Although many smaller nations and governments have since emerged from what was once Chinese land, China still assiduously maintains an imperialist attitude and considers itself the rightful proprietor of many of these islands which were long unclaimed or whose ownership was disputed or regarded as tacitly spoken for; much of that region, after all, is still grouped under the title "South China Sea," which does have a certain note of possession to it.

 

[Bigdog]

Constitutionally, Japan can't really act as an aggressor to war and they officially don't have a military. Yes, they have the self-defense forces, but they are still civilians.

Well, these uneasy relationships have existed for generations, its just this island issue gives an excuse to express the hate to a whole new level. shingamyeonblack talked about dokdo. since i live in japan, i have heard the islands as takeshima. i am aware if the issue gets severe, north korea would side with south korea. can't believe the dispute is that bad.

as for china's territory waters claims, reminds me of the 2001 US spy plane incident that landed in hainan. I remember a James Bond movie (I think Tomorrow Never Dies) where they address China claiming that anything beyond 20 miles or so is their waters.

If South Korea were to side with its Northern half , it would ruin its American relations, the ONLY reason they are still democratic and thriving than their mentally atrophied half full of real Asian leprechauns that worship their leader in the North. To associate with the North would be political suicide. And with China nonetheless?

Then again when you have some retards for politicians in the South that carried the hate to newer generations that today are more or less allies, it only questions how they are begging to lose their freedom and independence.

If people want to bitch over useless islands that have zero resources or anything to really gain, they deserve any bullshit war they get into because of it.

What is hilarious is that by being utter idiots, China is pretty much justifying all of the transgressions the Japanese did unto them generations ago. Then again, China's economy is in a bubble, so if that were to burst, whom is the real victor in all of this?

If China bursts, they lose all leverage and their resources, well they become available for everyone else to plunder and with how history happens in cycles, I'm predicting that if SK supports the N half, its gonna be screwed in the long run.

There's gonna be a new imperialism in China/East, but it won't be European if these countries continue down their path.

 

[shingamyeonblack]

Bigdog, you should just stop there. You don't know what's happening. Sorry.

ParaJaMo, yeah, it's unfortunate that Japan doesn't like the real name circling there. North Korea already supports South Korea's claim to the land because it's Korean land. It's still in the family. Officials in the North actually want the South to be more aggressive with its claims.

 

[Bigdog]

Bigdog, you should just stop there. You don't know what's happening. Sorry.

ParaJaMo, yeah, it's unfortunate that Japan doesn't like the real name circling there. North Korea already supports South Korea's claim to the land because it's Korean land. It's still in the family. Officials in the North actually want the South to be more aggressive with its claims.

I do admit that I am rather new to the conflict, however this situation is just too easy to analyze and pick apart from its pettiness.

I don't know what's happening? Yeah.... China's economy is in a bubble if you did not already know, so that makes it at a disadvantage already. As I recall learning in history, it repeats itself. Similar conflicts happened at the beginning of the 20th century which led to the colonization of Machuria , Korea and some other pieces of Chinese territory,which leads to the basis of the historical drama called IP Man of Japanese occupied China.

If China decides to screw around with some of its top money making nations, it will only screw that nation and any nation that allies itself with it.Unlike how many perceive the situation as purely America owing China , it is the other way around as it's economy is based around manufacturing our goods, which if you have not been under a rock on Dokho for the past fifteen years. If they try to pull anything against America or its allies, while both sides lose, China will be devastated moreso.

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/08/12/business/two-ways-to-see-chinas-problems-economic-view.html?_r=0

http://www.npr.org/blogs/money/2012/02/16/146861474/china-economic-miracle-or-bubble-waiting-to-pop

If these articles are remotely true, then I don't expect China to wage war as they have more to lose than gain.



South Korea is committing political suicide if they side with China [NK is a puppet state anyways] and if we are talking of a conflict between the two powers of China and Japan, aka proxy America, that is how its going to play out.

I'm fine with South Korea trying to "exert" its claims on these islands and all, but in exerting its claims at this time and throwing its lot with North Korea and thus China, they would be stupid to do so. Realistically speaking, South Korean politicians are tiptoeing the line dangerously when we are talking of already burdening tensions between China and Japan. All we need is another war over little bullshit that has nothing to do with anything other than merely petty political plays.

I guess if you want Asia to go to hell, it would be a great idea for China to aggressively attack Japan and for America to yet again fall into another war alongside the Israeli-Iranian conflict that seems to also be around the corner. It would be really nice if the Asian economy was decimated, now would it? [/sarcasm]

I'm just pointing out that this entire conflict puts too much at stake globally for minor islets that are nothing.


In my opinion, I'm siding with Japan for the fact that China has the worst human rights record on the planet and if South Korea was smart, they'd best not instigate anything, think real hard of why NK is encouraging this and just cede the island to the Japanese. What is the point of going into a pointless war over a pointless island that has few benefits?

So why does China want to kill itself again?

 

[shingamyeonblack]

I do admit that I am rather new to the conflict, however this situation is just too easy to analyze and pick apart from its pettiness.

I don't know what's happening? Yeah.... China's economy is in a bubble if you did not already know, so that makes it at a disadvantage already. As I recall learning in history, it repeats itself. Similar conflicts happened at the beginning of the 20th century which led to the colonization of Machuria , Korea and some other pieces of Chinese territory,which leads to the basis of the historical drama called IP Man of Japanese occupied China.

If China decides to screw around with some of its top money making nations, it will only screw that nation and any nation that allies itself with it.Unlike how many perceive the situation as purely America owing China , it is the other way around as it's economy is based around manufacturing our goods, which if you have not been under a rock on Dokho for the past fifteen years. If they try to pull anything against America or its allies, while both sides lose, China will be devastated moreso.

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/08/12/business/two-ways-to-see-chinas-problems-economic-view.html?_r=0

http://www.npr.org/blogs/money/2012/02/16/146861474/china-economic-miracle-or-bubble-waiting-to-pop

If these articles are remotely true, then I don't expect China to wage war as they have more to lose than gain.



South Korea is committing political suicide if they side with China [NK is a puppet state anyways] and if we are talking of a conflict between the two powers of China and Japan, aka proxy America, that is how its going to play out.

I'm fine with South Korea trying to "exert" its claims on these islands and all, but in exerting its claims at this time and throwing its lot with North Korea and thus China, they would be stupid to do so. Realistically speaking, South Korean politicians are tiptoeing the line dangerously when we are talking of already burdening tensions between China and Japan. All we need is another war over little bullshit that has nothing to do with anything other than merely petty political plays.

I guess if you want Asia to go to hell, it would be a great idea for China to aggressively attack Japan and for America to yet again fall into another war alongside the Israeli-Iranian conflict that seems to also be around the corner. It would be really nice if the Asian economy was decimated, now would it? [/sarcasm]

I'm just pointing out that this entire conflict puts too much at stake globally for minor islets that are nothing.


In my opinion, I'm siding with Japan for the fact that China has the worst human rights record on the planet and if South Korea was smart, they'd best not instigate anything, think real hard of why NK is encouraging this and just cede the island to the Japanese. What is the point of going into a pointless war over a pointless island that has few benefits?

So why does China want to kill itself again?

No, man. ParaParaJMo was thinking that North Korea would side with South Korea. ParaJaMo did not know that it already happened, but it's not that big of a deal. You basically changed it to South Korea siding with North Korea's claim to the land. The land is under the jurisdiction of the South. You can't pick that to analyze if you do not know what is happening.

China may want the land now, but it's not quite an invasion.

Everyone knows that China is the major trade partner, but we also know that the United States is on the losing end of the relationship. The thing is that everyone is on the losing end if trade comes to a complete halt between major trade countries. That's why everyone is being cautious not to upset China right now.


South Korea is not claiming the same islands as China. They actually would fight China over them as well. South Korea is claiming other islands at the same time that China is claiming islands. South Korea actually has had a strong and steady claim over many years. It's not like it's new.

North Korea is not claiming the islands.

There is no reason for Korea to let Japan take its islands. There especially is no reason after what Japan did to the country and its people. Japan keeps forcing open wounds because of its greed.

This is why I told you to stop. You do not understand the situation. You're being all generic about bits of information that you think you know.


Sorry about the name, ParaParaJMo.