Nolan Batman #3: The Dark Knight Rises

[Bolt]

I get what you're saying, but unfortunately I think you're going to have a tough time convincing most people who are unfamiliar with Bane's nuances as a character why he's a prime villain. The fact is, most of the time in our society conceptions of extreme physical strength and exceptional intelligence are incompatible because of how deeply ingrained the archetype of "bumbling strongman" has become. If someone has difficult accepting Bane as a clever, scheming antagonist, it's most likely because they're incapable of reconciling the ideas of strength and intelligence. The costume probably doesn't help that image--the skintight leotard bodysuit and luchador-inspired facemask bearing many similarities to the classic image of an muscle-bound pro wrestler, and the wires and tubes stemming from Bane's body reminiscent of Frankenstein's brain damaged monster--it makes you wonder how perceptions of the character might change if Bane's standard costume was a labcoat and a surgeon's mask.

 

[KingRanger]

Christopher Nolan's Batman movies are not made for fans of the comics; they're made for audiences at large with only a passing knowledge of the Batman mythos and its most famous figures. I.

Wow.. Just.. No...:redface2:

 

[Bolt]

Care to elaborate or are you just going to leave it ambiguous so that you don't have to explain yourself?

 

[Kivat]

Wow.. Just.. No...:redface2:

KR I don't see how what he said doesn't make sense. I can almost bet that's exactly what the crew is going by. I wouldn't say they're not for the comic fans at all...but they probably do come in a close 2nd in the thought process.

 

[musashi03]

The fact is, most of the time in our society conceptions of extreme physical strength and exceptional intelligence are incompatible because of how deeply ingrained the archetype of "bumbling strongman" has become.

Yeah, they pretty much undermine our high intelligence, you and I. Tsk... :disappoin

Wow.. Just.. No...:redface2:

In a sense though, I think I agree with you that Nolan doesn't exactly do movies for non-fans. When compared to others who has directed Batman films, I can see Nolan as the guy who pretty much went back to basics with Batman, grabbing what makes Batman unique among all other superheroes and showcasing it to the world.

 

[Galaxian]

In a sense though, I think I agree with you that Nolan doesn't exactly do movies for non-fans. When compared to others who has directed Batman films, I can see Nolan as the guy who pretty much went back to basics with Batman, grabbing what makes Batman unique among all other superheroes and showcasing it to the world.

I agree, Nolan has even state that for Begins he consciously decided to use villains that non-fans would be unfamiliar with.

 

[Bolt]

But that statement contains the point I'm making: he chooses villains and attributes and interpretations of characters that non-fans aren't familiar with, so that what appears in his movies will be fresh and novel to them. That doesn't at all mean that he's directing his vision at fans of the comics (if that were the case, why didn't he follow up on the Ra's Al-Ghul storyline? Why didn't his Joker reproduce any of his memorable moments from the comics? Where is Dick Grayson?)

If anything, Nolan has made more declarations that he is intentionally avoiding certain characters and ideas from the books because they don't feel appropriate for the theme of the story he's trying to tell. He's creating his own shade of the classic Batman storyline, and for that he's drawing partly from the source material in order to implement ideas that haven't been seen in other Batman films, but he's making his films for *audiences* in general; just because a lesser-known character makes gets an appearance or mention doesn't mean that it's Nolan's way of paying tribute to fans. They're just tools he's working with to craft his own imagining.

That's not to say that he doesn't have the fans in mind. He'd be crazy not to, knowing that they'll constitute a large portion of viewers. I just think fans sometimes get carried away presuming that certain creators do certain things especially to appeal to them.

 

[urugoji]

^
Are you saying that it's a bad thing that Nolan does that or are you just pointing out that that is how he operates?

In my opinion, the interpretations of the characters in the films are certainly informed by the characterizations in the comic books. It's just that they take a very broad look at them, instead of selecting individual aspects and storylines.

EDIT: By the way, I don't think ANYBODY wants to see Dick Grayson in one of these movies. I mean, can you imagine gruff Christian Bale hanging out with a little kid? LOL

 

[Bigdog]

But that statement contains the point I'm making: he chooses villains and attributes and interpretations of characters that non-fans aren't familiar with, so that what appears in his movies will be fresh and novel to them. That doesn't at all mean that he's directing his vision at fans of the comics (if that were the case, why didn't he follow up on the Ra's Al-Ghul storyline? Why didn't his Joker reproduce any of his memorable moments from the comics? Where is Dick Grayson?)

If anything, Nolan has made more declarations that he is intentionally avoiding certain characters and ideas from the books because they don't feel appropriate for the theme of the story he's trying to tell. He's creating his own shade of the classic Batman storyline, and for that he's drawing partly from the source material in order to implement ideas that haven't been seen in other Batman films, but he's making his films for *audiences* in general; just because a lesser-known character makes gets an appearance or mention doesn't mean that it's Nolan's way of paying tribute to fans. They're just tools he's working with to craft his own imagining.

That's not to say that he doesn't have the fans in mind. He'd be crazy not to, knowing that they'll constitute a large portion of viewers. I just think fans sometimes get carried away presuming that certain creators do certain things especially to appeal to them.

I love his imagining of the Batman saga and it ranks high with Bruce Timm's animated saga from the 1990's to Beyond.

^
Are you saying that it's a bad thing that Nolan does that or are you just pointing out that that is how he operates?

In my opinion, the interpretations of the characters in the films are certainly informed by the characterizations in the comic books. It's just that they take a very broad look at them, instead of selecting individual aspects and storylines.

EDIT: By the way, I don't think ANYBODY wants to see Dick Grayson in one of these movies. I mean, can you imagine gruff Christian Bale hanging out with a little kid? LOL

Here's my concept :

Age Dick to a teenager or adult (albeit highly intelligent ,16-19) and you have your Robin. Possible origin : Pursuing his family's business of acrobatics , or in this this case , perhaps maybe changed to a rich son of a washed out martial art film star and a highly successful actress, Dick wants to be everything his parents were and more . One day during the shooting of a film where Dick would've made his debut and his father's comeback , his parents are gunned down in a mafioso-esque fashion and he is left wanting the heads of the killers.

Bruce, who went there to see his Mr.Grayson's shooting of the film by a studio financed by Wayne , allows Dick to stay with him for a bit and becoming in a sense, a father figure observing him. But he is distant ,even aloof. Alfred advises him to reach out more , but Bruce in secret is afraid of getting closer to the boy ,and with that Dick seeps a bit deeper into darkness. He infrequently goes to his college classes, and yet drops out and after Bruce disowns him , turns to crime.

In this moment , Dick assumes the identity as the "Robin" to rob those like Bruce , utilizing his acrobatics and martial art skills against body-guards, even some crime lords under work by rivals. He gets in too deep, he gets captured. Batman tries to saves him, but he too is outmatched. Dick teams up with the caped crusader and evades the thugs ,and Batman reveals himself as Bruce . The battle makes him realize he needs help ,and Dick thus becomes the Robin and goes back to college , with Bruce as his mentor and father figure.

Not that hard to figure out .

 

[musashi03]

That's not to say that he doesn't have the fans in mind. He'd be crazy not to, knowing that they'll constitute a large portion of viewers. I just think fans sometimes get carried away presuming that certain creators do certain things especially to appeal to them.

Yes I agree with you, but I'm not complaining on how Nolan does things, just the way some people perceive the characters of the movie, totally ignoring where the character was based from in the first place. No matter how different any director would change a character to fit the storyline he's trying to tell, there's still those elements that were taken from the original character which most people fail to acknowledge, which is what saddens me. Like brushing off Bane as simply just this big guy who happens to be smart, not realizing there's more to Bane and how he has impacted Batman in the comics.