GekiBlack
Red Falcon
Yeah, i'd vote for Shizuka too but she is JBI'd vote Shizuka, but they toss her around the series like nothing.
So Otoya it is. :thumbs:
So, my female vote goes to Megumi
Most favorite Kiva's character
- Thread starter aniking_8
- Start date
So, my female vote goes to Megumi
Aoi Kurenai
Mad Skillz
People treat Otoya with respect only when he puts up that facade of being happy. It's pretty clear that he's not a trouble free guy like he wants others to think. He acts the way he does because he probably thinks that's the only way to get people to like him. It may be part of who he is, but the way I see it, it's not who he wants to be. And so what if he doesn't muse? You say Wataru is more stable, but the way I see it, Otoya has more going for him. His mission in life is to show people the true beauty of music and bring out the inner music in others, there's a woman he loves and even though she doesn't feel anything for him, he's going through hell to protect her, that seems pretty noble to me.
How do you know that it wasn't he decision to become a recluse? How do any of us know? We don't. We've had almost nothing revealed about his past other than Otoya, for whatever reason, wasn't around during his childhood and his mom isn't in the picture anymore. Maybe that's what made him become afraid of the world? I don't see how being able to do something like going out into the world makes Wataru a better character than Otoya. Wataru's had people guiding him, or at least people who care about him, so far Otoya's been out there alone with the world against him.
HenshiNDUT_M11
ヒビキラッ☆
Have to wait until the series end to vote who is my real fave, but this far, my fave are:
for female character: Megumi, absolutely
for male character(s): hard to choose between Otoya and Jiro
for other character: Kivat Batsansei(He'll Kivat me if I don't choose him)
for female character: Megumi, absolutely
for male character(s): hard to choose between Otoya and Jiro
for other character: Kivat Batsansei(He'll Kivat me if I don't choose him)
Mele
Member
I see Otoya under a whole different light than you. :anime:
@ Ryoutarou: We know that he is a successful and much-valued Violinist, even considered a musical Genius, he is really respected and liked by many people, was always lucky with woman and that he is wealthy. We don´t know anything from his past, but I´m sure that he grew up with parents. Violins are still very exclusive instruments, no poor child could effort even one, let alone lessons to learn it, so he must have had help and support. Otoya appears in general very lukewarm, even when he plays the Violin. The reason could be because he was very spoiled and used of getting everything he wants, if he would have had to fight for apprication or anything just once before, he would know how to do that without being brash and annoying. That´s easy psychology, he just appears to have a "omphalos"-complex and can´t deal with being rejected. A woman who rebuffs him for the first time is a call out for him, he doesn´t even truly needs to love her. Until now he just played around with woman, why should Yuri suddenly be different? Maybe Yuri is just a special appeal because she isn´t falling for him and he would drop her the instant she gives in, regardless what he said before. He doesn´t comes around as that dead-serious. Nobody knows. The same goes that for the first time he doesn´t get respect (= Jirou) and complete trust (= Shima). He just wants to prove them wrong like a little sulking kid.
When have we seen that Otoya´s blatant and arrogant behaving is just a facade? There was not one moment he wasn´t acting like a fool. Even when he told Yuri about the beautiful music in her, he came around as shallow and wanna-be-enchanter, not really serious and deep like Megumi in comparison when she repeated those words and Wataru when he is soaking off in his sorrows. If it´s a facade and if Otoya really has problems with whatever there is then the director would have shown us a scene in which he muses about these problems and his real intentions by now. But so is Otoya just a man who in general has everything: Success, money, prestige and just can´t deal with one single defeat. So if he really has serious life issues, how you say, he should maybe look up a couch doctor, seriously. :redface2:
Wataru on the other side. Well, how do we know that it wasn´t his own decision to become a recluse? That´s easy to answer, because he was still a baby then and couldn´t make the decision how he wants to grow up on his own. When he was born he had at least his mother, but was still a child without a father, new contacts and friends outside his scope (= home) until we met him. But still, the boy has become bright and bountiful and not a malcontent grimmer or worse. Curiously he wants to become like his father, maybe because it´s the only way he can get to know and be close to him. Instinctively he knows how to fight and wants to help humans. He has his little worries and problems too, but brushes them off if something more important occurs. He even risks his life without hesitation for strangers or some special natural enemies. Yes, Wataru is very naive and trustful, not blatant or reckless like most other male characters, but that´s making him special. He is thinking with his heart and just goes for it.
I have the feeling that in the end the thing that made Otoya such a great man how so many people say, might be that he matured himself, found his true love and most important: That he had Wataru!
@ Ryoutarou: We know that he is a successful and much-valued Violinist, even considered a musical Genius, he is really respected and liked by many people, was always lucky with woman and that he is wealthy. We don´t know anything from his past, but I´m sure that he grew up with parents. Violins are still very exclusive instruments, no poor child could effort even one, let alone lessons to learn it, so he must have had help and support. Otoya appears in general very lukewarm, even when he plays the Violin. The reason could be because he was very spoiled and used of getting everything he wants, if he would have had to fight for apprication or anything just once before, he would know how to do that without being brash and annoying. That´s easy psychology, he just appears to have a "omphalos"-complex and can´t deal with being rejected. A woman who rebuffs him for the first time is a call out for him, he doesn´t even truly needs to love her. Until now he just played around with woman, why should Yuri suddenly be different? Maybe Yuri is just a special appeal because she isn´t falling for him and he would drop her the instant she gives in, regardless what he said before. He doesn´t comes around as that dead-serious. Nobody knows. The same goes that for the first time he doesn´t get respect (= Jirou) and complete trust (= Shima). He just wants to prove them wrong like a little sulking kid.
When have we seen that Otoya´s blatant and arrogant behaving is just a facade? There was not one moment he wasn´t acting like a fool. Even when he told Yuri about the beautiful music in her, he came around as shallow and wanna-be-enchanter, not really serious and deep like Megumi in comparison when she repeated those words and Wataru when he is soaking off in his sorrows. If it´s a facade and if Otoya really has problems with whatever there is then the director would have shown us a scene in which he muses about these problems and his real intentions by now. But so is Otoya just a man who in general has everything: Success, money, prestige and just can´t deal with one single defeat. So if he really has serious life issues, how you say, he should maybe look up a couch doctor, seriously. :redface2:
Wataru on the other side. Well, how do we know that it wasn´t his own decision to become a recluse? That´s easy to answer, because he was still a baby then and couldn´t make the decision how he wants to grow up on his own. When he was born he had at least his mother, but was still a child without a father, new contacts and friends outside his scope (= home) until we met him. But still, the boy has become bright and bountiful and not a malcontent grimmer or worse. Curiously he wants to become like his father, maybe because it´s the only way he can get to know and be close to him. Instinctively he knows how to fight and wants to help humans. He has his little worries and problems too, but brushes them off if something more important occurs. He even risks his life without hesitation for strangers or some special natural enemies. Yes, Wataru is very naive and trustful, not blatant or reckless like most other male characters, but that´s making him special. He is thinking with his heart and just goes for it.
I have the feeling that in the end the thing that made Otoya such a great man how so many people say, might be that he matured himself, found his true love and most important: That he had Wataru!
Aoi Kurenai
Mad Skillz
Yes, I've noticed we have veeeeery different opinions on this. XD
We don't know if he's rich or not. You don't need to be rich to pick up a violin, maybe he came upon one as a child and people saw how talented he was. That's probably what lead him to believe the world was his play thing, but lately things have been different and he's been wanting to change, to prove to himself and to other people that he hasn't had everything handed to him and that he can earn things in life just as well as the next person. How can you say he would just drop Yuri if she were ever to actually admit feelings for him? Look at all the times that Jiro's beat the crap out of him, jumping in front of Fangire attacks meant for Yuri, there's no way he sees her as just a prize that he can't get. He has actual feelings for her. Maybe at first he saw her as just another goal, but that eventually started blossoming into real feelings for her.
When we see him talk seriously about music, about Yuri and other things. To me it comes off as the person he really is, or at least who he wants to be, not the guy always prancing around acting like he's on top the world. I don't see how he came off as shallow when he told Yuri those things, to me it seems like you just like Koji Seto better and that's playing into your judgment of the characters. I thought both scenes were pretty heartfelt and showed some good depth to the characters. Again, so what if we haven't been shown him musing? Not everything needs to be handed to us on a silver platter, I like it when shows give you subtle clues to the true intentions of the characters and not just yell them out for the whole world to see. Otoya may have had certain things that made him forget he actually had to work for stuff in life, but once he was drawn into the Blue Sky organization and the Fangire war, things started getting drawn more into perspective for him.
He's an adult now, he's been living on his own for a while, or we're lead to assume that he has been, to me that tells me that at any time he could have gone out to explore the world on his own. If it's like you say that it wasn't his choice to become a recluse, then it sure was his choice to stay one for such a long time. I like where his character's going, but I don't see how he's better than Otoya. At the core they're the same person, someone looking to be accepted into a world they don't really know anything about, they're just portrayed differently in that aspect, and I just happen to like Otoya's portrayal of it better. Wataru's too much of a "perfect" human, I think Otoya is a much more realistic take, albeit still pretty out there, like you said, Wataru's one of those guys that would just smile go off to help his friends, that seems too idealistic to me, it somewhat reminds me of Ryoutarou but he was often on the receiving end of punishments, so he at least knew what it was like to suffer, Wataru just instinctively knows what to do, probably because of his parents was a Fangire. There are many different angles they could take with his character, but right now they're just going down the route of "he fights and does the right thing because it's in his blood", that's something Otoya is still learning. He's a flawed character, which is one of the reasons that I like him better than Wataru.
That I agree with. Like I said, Otoya is still learning about sacrifice, I think that having a child will probably make him see the bigger picture and that it's not just about him or those close to him, but protecting everyone who needs help. Something that he probably passes on to Wataru if my hunch about Otoya is correct.
Mele
Member
@ Ryoutarou
Oka~y, that went long again ... :O_O:
But it´s fun :anime:
- Living in a old-style european mansion close to Tokyo means that you are wealthy.
- It´s impossible to pick-up a Violin and be able to play it right away. I mean, this is one of the most difficult instruments we are talking about here and it needs up to 20 years to get at the level Otoya is supposed to be on, even when you are skilled. And if you want to be good, you need good material. Really good Violins are very, very expensive. I really don´t think that somebody gave him free lessons and a Violin, just because they saw his talent. But when, it was support and by people who believed in Otoya -either parents or strangers - and that´s more than Wataru had.
- Otoya worked until now successfully as Violinist and he accomplished that he is appreciated with it. It´s not that he is popular for nothing. We don´t get any hints that he isn´t happy with his life, that he has trouble, problems or that he wants to change. The only person who tried to change forcefully was Wataru in the beginning. But in the end, it´s not possible. You have to be patience and try to do your best, that worked for Wataru.
- I think if Otoya wouldn´t want to be a Violinist anymore, he wouldn´t carry it around constantly, just throw it away forever.
- Isn´t the meaning of storytelling that they tell us about the characters and what they think, which action they take? Whenever you want to read between the lines, it´s always in danger of getting out of Character.
- We only know that he likes Yuri, dislikes Jirou, wants Yuri, isn´t happy about being rejected and fights over Yuri
- Yes, I think there is a high possibility that Otoya might just drop Yuri when she is cabing in. And seeing how it´s getting more and more unlikely for her to be Wataru´s mothers ...
- You know the feeling of a child that urgently wants only one toy no matter what? Otoya behaves similar. Of course is he okay with getting beaten up by Jirou. He is his concurrent in the fight over Yuri and Otoya wants to prove to him that he is the better alpha-leader and can fight at least just as well and that he deserves her more. It´s manlike manner to fight it out, isn´t it?
- I said that I find Megumi repeated the words about the music with more deepness than Otoya did in the first place, because he was more trying to only charm Yuri. Megumi gave a view to her feelings for her mum. Wataru´s musings I mentioned are different scenes (mostly the bath-scenes), for example when he was wondering about humans, why they can´t get along or about his dream.
- It´s not alone the actors and their portrayal of the characters that I prefer Wataru by far.
- There are hundred of ways Otoya could have tried to capture Yuri´s heart in the recent 15 episodes, but he doesn´t even try another way. Why? If he would really love and do everything for her, he would make his brain work out all kind of possible different ways to wake sympathy in her. But until now he is only known as the Clown.
- Well, if you think about it, of course was Wataru not able to leave the home like a normal boy until he was teached a lesson by Megumi. He grew up somewhere between fear and inexperience and he just now is starting slowly to blossom.
- We don´t know when Wataru´s mother left him, but we know that he efforts his life on his very own. He is working, Ryo didn´t and Otoya doesn´t seems to see it as necessary.
- Wataru is no perfect kid at all. He still has so much to learn and to catch up with. He is very unsure of himself, has no sense of self-worth, he is very selfless almost to the point were he seems to only live for others but not for himself and way too trusting. Wataru missed a lot of very normal teenage things like going to school, making friends and falling in love - everything Otoya had.
- But Wataru´s honesty and bravery are true hero material and he knows what counts. He isn´t smiling and proceeds to action. His instinct might tell him how to fight, but he starts to question his supposed enemies and even became reluctant, but when he sees that it´s important to fight for saving someone, he fights without a second thought.
- And of course is it´s making Wataru even more interesting that he is no normal boy, he is caught between two worlds. We don´t know for sure yet how much he knows about himself and how he will develop in the future, but that´s what Kiva is about!
- In comparison we know the what Otoya´s life is about and the result, we only have to wait and see how things will click in place.
- So far we only know that Otoya left the Blood Rose for Wataru. He has no personal memory about his Dad, not even some words or how he really was. But the boy was able to recognize his fathers Violin play, intuitively. How said, his interaction with things and other people is so innocent and therefore fascinating.
Another thing about Wataru vs. Ryo: They are both very different. Ryo was altogether weak in every part of his life and needed friends as support. Wataru is a much more independent person, can look after himself and owns a inner-strength and will to fight.
Oka~y, that went long again ... :O_O:
But it´s fun :anime:
- Living in a old-style european mansion close to Tokyo means that you are wealthy.
- It´s impossible to pick-up a Violin and be able to play it right away. I mean, this is one of the most difficult instruments we are talking about here and it needs up to 20 years to get at the level Otoya is supposed to be on, even when you are skilled. And if you want to be good, you need good material. Really good Violins are very, very expensive. I really don´t think that somebody gave him free lessons and a Violin, just because they saw his talent. But when, it was support and by people who believed in Otoya -either parents or strangers - and that´s more than Wataru had.
- Otoya worked until now successfully as Violinist and he accomplished that he is appreciated with it. It´s not that he is popular for nothing. We don´t get any hints that he isn´t happy with his life, that he has trouble, problems or that he wants to change. The only person who tried to change forcefully was Wataru in the beginning. But in the end, it´s not possible. You have to be patience and try to do your best, that worked for Wataru.
- I think if Otoya wouldn´t want to be a Violinist anymore, he wouldn´t carry it around constantly, just throw it away forever.
- Isn´t the meaning of storytelling that they tell us about the characters and what they think, which action they take? Whenever you want to read between the lines, it´s always in danger of getting out of Character.
- We only know that he likes Yuri, dislikes Jirou, wants Yuri, isn´t happy about being rejected and fights over Yuri
- Yes, I think there is a high possibility that Otoya might just drop Yuri when she is cabing in. And seeing how it´s getting more and more unlikely for her to be Wataru´s mothers ...
- You know the feeling of a child that urgently wants only one toy no matter what? Otoya behaves similar. Of course is he okay with getting beaten up by Jirou. He is his concurrent in the fight over Yuri and Otoya wants to prove to him that he is the better alpha-leader and can fight at least just as well and that he deserves her more. It´s manlike manner to fight it out, isn´t it?
- I said that I find Megumi repeated the words about the music with more deepness than Otoya did in the first place, because he was more trying to only charm Yuri. Megumi gave a view to her feelings for her mum. Wataru´s musings I mentioned are different scenes (mostly the bath-scenes), for example when he was wondering about humans, why they can´t get along or about his dream.
- It´s not alone the actors and their portrayal of the characters that I prefer Wataru by far.
- There are hundred of ways Otoya could have tried to capture Yuri´s heart in the recent 15 episodes, but he doesn´t even try another way. Why? If he would really love and do everything for her, he would make his brain work out all kind of possible different ways to wake sympathy in her. But until now he is only known as the Clown.
- Well, if you think about it, of course was Wataru not able to leave the home like a normal boy until he was teached a lesson by Megumi. He grew up somewhere between fear and inexperience and he just now is starting slowly to blossom.
- We don´t know when Wataru´s mother left him, but we know that he efforts his life on his very own. He is working, Ryo didn´t and Otoya doesn´t seems to see it as necessary.
- Wataru is no perfect kid at all. He still has so much to learn and to catch up with. He is very unsure of himself, has no sense of self-worth, he is very selfless almost to the point were he seems to only live for others but not for himself and way too trusting. Wataru missed a lot of very normal teenage things like going to school, making friends and falling in love - everything Otoya had.
- But Wataru´s honesty and bravery are true hero material and he knows what counts. He isn´t smiling and proceeds to action. His instinct might tell him how to fight, but he starts to question his supposed enemies and even became reluctant, but when he sees that it´s important to fight for saving someone, he fights without a second thought.
- And of course is it´s making Wataru even more interesting that he is no normal boy, he is caught between two worlds. We don´t know for sure yet how much he knows about himself and how he will develop in the future, but that´s what Kiva is about!
- In comparison we know the what Otoya´s life is about and the result, we only have to wait and see how things will click in place.
- So far we only know that Otoya left the Blood Rose for Wataru. He has no personal memory about his Dad, not even some words or how he really was. But the boy was able to recognize his fathers Violin play, intuitively. How said, his interaction with things and other people is so innocent and therefore fascinating.
Another thing about Wataru vs. Ryo: They are both very different. Ryo was altogether weak in every part of his life and needed friends as support. Wataru is a much more independent person, can look after himself and owns a inner-strength and will to fight.
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Red Infinity Ranger
Member
My least favorite character in Kiva(if not Kamen Rider in general) is Nago. Mainly because when something bad happens to him, he doesn't take responsiblity. For example, when he was defeated by Kiva, he kept saying that it was the Rider System's fault, not him, the rider. But everyone knows that the weapon is only as good as it's wielder. Also, he sees the world in black and white. To me, he seems more of a villian than a hero.
NathanTZ
Member
Same here,man. Same here. But I would have voted Shizuka as #1 girl on the show.
