The Heisei Era Could End...Soonish

[lazycoconut]

Riderman's survival was explained, though not entirely on-screen. I wouldn't say that's a continuity problem, it's more like the typical case of a popular character surviving. I see it in the same way as (SPOILER ALERT FOR GAIM): [HIDE]Takatora being dead for a while, and then at the end of the penultimate episode, we discover he had survived all along.[/HIDE] Is that a problem with continuity?

I think that's a bit different ...

[HIDE]Takatora's fate was left ambiguous, but the lack of a body and the very strong implications that Micchy's "visions" of him were hallucinations left open the possibility he had survived. It then emerged Takatora was still alive but "brain dead" and wasn't going to survive - but Kouta then revived him so that he could help Micchy. That was a pretty significant plot point and fit with what the story had given us thus far.[/HIDE]

Riderman on the other hand was clearly supposed to be dead and IMO his reappearance is more like when soap operas kill off a popular character (body identified, funeral held, the works) only to bring them back years later with some contrived retcon. The fans know it's stupid but don't care since they like the character

 

[NeonZ]

First of all, crossover movie or taisen and such were meant for fun purposes only..not really meant for plot heavily implied that our riders actually "shares" a world together
No.......i don't care how serious they put or shove it to our throats that our heroes could actually meet each other face to face

However, i DO want to see they establish a new kind of shared universe ala mcu
Afterall, toei already kinda influenced by mcu for their gritty net series....maybe made it a new modern enemy organizations
Not putting a "insert-new-term" shocker all over again, just a new evil lurking in the back

That's essentially how Shocker has been used in the last two years. They're going back to the original concept of it being a large organization entrenched in the world, and even though the heroes stop their plans, the organization still exists and doesn't fall apart after a single battle, unlike Decade's movies or SHT. Note that it's even just called "Shocker", no Super or Dai or Space. "Nova Shocker" was portrayed as a separate organization that existed at the same time as Shocker proper.

I think that's a bit different ...

[HIDE]Takatora's fate was left ambiguous, but the lack of a body and the very strong implications that Micchy's "visions" of him were hallucinations left open the possibility he had survived. It then emerged Takatora was still alive but "brain dead" and wasn't going to survive - but Kouta then revived him so that he could help Micchy. That was a pretty significant plot point and fit with what the story had given us thus far.[/HIDE]

Riderman on the other hand was clearly supposed to be dead and IMO his reappearance is more like when soap operas kill off a popular character (body identified, funeral held, the works) only to bring them back years later with some contrived retcon. The fans know it's stupid but don't care since they like the character

Riderman originally died in an explosion, with no body left behind. The death wasn't considered ambiguous in V3 itself, but it's not like Shiro carried his dead body like Shigeru carried Tackle's or something like that. Rider 1 and 2 themselves had already returned from a similar death in V3. Rider 1 also had seemingly died from a midair explosion in the beginning of the Gel-Shocker arc of the original series, only to return one episode later.

 

[lazycoconut]

Riderman originally died in an explosion, with no body left behind. The death wasn't considered ambiguous in V3 itself, but it's not like Shiro carried his dead body like Shigeru carried Tackle's or something like that. Rider 1 and 2 themselves had already returned from a similar death in V3. Rider 1 also had seemingly died from a midair explosion in the beginning of the Gel-Shocker arc of the original series, only to return one episode later.

That's true, but

[HIDE]Takatora's situation was an important part of the show's ending and planned that way, not a case of leaving it open in case viewers wanted him back. A more comparable example would be if Toei had decided Gai Yuuki wasn't dead or something[/HIDE]

 

[Khaiden]

I think that's a bit different ...

[HIDE]Takatora's fate was left ambiguous, but the lack of a body and the very strong implications that Micchy's "visions" of him were hallucinations left open the possibility he had survived. It then emerged Takatora was still alive but "brain dead" and wasn't going to survive - but Kouta then revived him so that he could help Micchy. That was a pretty significant plot point and fit with what the story had given us thus far.[/HIDE]

Riderman on the other hand was clearly supposed to be dead and IMO his reappearance is more like when soap operas kill off a popular character (body identified, funeral held, the works) only to bring them back years later with some contrived retcon. The fans know it's stupid but don't care since they like the character

That's a very good point. I didn't see it like that.
It is a different situation, then. There are better examples.

Riderman originally died in an explosion, with no body left behind. The death wasn't considered ambiguous in V3 itself, but it's not like Shiro carried his dead body like Shigeru carried Tackle's or something like that. Rider 1 and 2 themselves had already returned from a similar death in V3. Rider 1 also had seemingly died from a midair explosion in the beginning of the Gel-Shocker arc of the original series, only to return one episode later.

Ah, how could I forget to mention these? These are definitely examples of why Riderman's return is not really a continuity problem, it's just the return of a character because he was well received.

 

[LaZerwolfX]

Because it expands the mythology of the series to more than just a basic generic super hero show. Unlike Sentai, Kamen Rider originally had a shared universe for its Showa era, which disappeared until W. It also means that some events could have consequences that occur in later series, adding even more to the stories. There is a reason why the Marvel Cinematic Universe is successful. The last time we really had shared universes in movies was with the classic Universal monsters stuff and Toho's Showa era of Kaiju.

But it doesn't really; like at all. With something like the Marvel movies the shared world is the linch-pin. Every film hearkens back to prior films and it is shaped in a way to actually add and contribute to the overall image.

Kamen Rider doesn't do that, not even close. The best KR does is effectively saying "Hey! these guys are neighbors sometimes and they could technically visit each other but they pretty much never will outside of the movies! And most of which have become the same thing time and time again!" They aren't actually contributing to one another in any sort of substantial way. If characters from one series even went to the location of a prior series (like if the KR Ghost crew made a trip to Fuuto or something like that, that would at least be SOMETHING. All we ever get is a loose throwaway line and maybe a clip. But simply showing a clip will never provide the substantive connection of actually incorporating elements from prior series. It's not like Japan is that big of a place, do you really think it makes any sort of sense that former riders wouldn't show up all the goddamn time to help out if they were actually in a shared world? Why wouldn't they?

It simply isn't a proper shared universe, due to the format of the show and several other factors it clearly benefits Toei to play it super loose with any sort of cross-continuity as it allows them to have things be as connected or disconnected as they want whenever. But that doesn't actually require nearly the same effort as something like the MCU. If you wanna delude yourself, that's chill; but don't spout it out as though it's gospel truth or try and play like it's not the softest and laziest attempt at a shared universe ever.

 

[Toku Prime]

Yeah American comic book heroes have a different format that IMO makes crossovers work better in-universe. Those heroes have their own rogues gallery that they will battle forever. So between crossovers they're all busy protecting their individual patches and having their own adventures.

On the other hand toku heroes tend to have a single enemy to battle and a pre-determined amount of time for their story to last. Which means they get the definitive "walking victoriously off into the sunset" style ending that Marvel or DC heroes can never have, but it also makes them very linear.

If Spiderman and Doc Ock are fighting in the middle of Times Square and the Fantastic Four don't show up, we can presume that they are off fighting some other villain elsewhere. But when a giant monster suddenly appears, shouts "Thank You Naria!" and starts to demolish skyscrapers and trample people, why do none of the 200+ veteran Sentai warriors ever show up? They don't have their own villains to battle any more. Have they all lost their passion for protecting people? Is there some sort of unspoken rule that you have to stay away unless Akaranger personally requests your help? Is Japanese daytime TV just that damn good that none of them can bear to leave the house anymore?

Anyway, just my own 2 cents. To each their own. :anime:

 

[Khaiden]

Yeah American comic book heroes have a different format that IMO makes crossovers work better in-universe. Those heroes have their own rogues gallery that they will battle forever. So between crossovers they're all busy protecting their individual patches and having their own adventures.

On the other hand toku heroes tend to have a single enemy to battle and a pre-determined amount of time for their story to last. Which means they get the definitive "walking victoriously off into the sunset" style ending that Marvel or DC heroes can never have, but it also makes them very linear.

If Spiderman and Doc Ock are fighting in the middle of Times Square and the Fantastic Four don't show up, we can presume that they are off fighting some other villain elsewhere. But when a giant monster suddenly appears, shouts "Thank You Naria!" and starts to demolish skyscrapers and trample people, why do none of the 200+ veteran Sentai warriors ever show up? They don't have their own villains to battle any more. Have they all lost their passion for protecting people? Is there some sort of unspoken rule that you have to stay away unless Akaranger personally requests your help? Is Japanese daytime TV just that damn good that none of them can bear to leave the house anymore?

Anyway, just my own 2 cents. To each their own. :anime:

One of the million dollar questions. Sometimes they explain it. Sometimes they don't. Once again I call back to the Hirayama era (1971-1984) for examples: Back in the day, most of the organizations were worldwide threats, which meant that the other Riders were also fighting other branches of the current villain.

The SPIRITS manga and recent appearances have given the explanation that they also save the world and help people in other ways. One Rider is a doctor, another is helping in a war-torn country, another has to take care of his mentor's granddaughter, another is researching how to improve the quality of life, another is protecting a city.

And then there are others who just don't care or have a personality that makes them reluctant to immediately jump in to help, as Decade illustrated nicely in KR Taisen.

Obviously, I'm talking about Rider here. Sentai is another matter that I don't know much about.