Is it best that toei and bandai should cancel Kr and ss and make a new one?

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You have literally not read even a single word in any post that is responding to you.

How do you expect people to give a **** if you're going to push your thoughts and opinions without giving any other posts a second thought? I just don't understand your mentality when you post.

I know about those things but i was saying this reply as a form of expression and was sad about this process


It is not my personal opinion that Sentai and Kamen Rider are marketed to different age groups. It's fact. It's who Toei and Bandai target - once a child grows out of Sentai, he is then supposed to start watching Kamen Rider, and will buy the toys for that show instead. Thus, they can sell more toys. Having just one show would kill that, and sales would drop. It's the same principle as brands that have a "For men" and "For women" range, where the "women's" product is pink but otherwise exactly the same as the "men's." Or why chocolate brands do "Fun size" and "Snack size" as well as the regular one - so that more people buy them!

Good point :disappoin



Because they make their money from the toys. And toy sales are what fund the shows in the first place. They don't do this out of love; they do it to make money!

Yeah,I know


I don't know what they'd put into Sentai's slot. An anime, probably (it's got to be something that fits into a children's programming block, after all.) But they'd have to go with something that they know will make money, and that something is probably not going to be a completely original untested show

Anime would be nice but i prefer original tokusatsu series or maybe a reboot of a comedy toku series robocon like the one from 2000 though we should find something suitable for the demographic.


My question is, why should the franchise care about being "faithful"? Shotaro Ishinomori wrote the manga adaptations of the TV series and felt quite free to make massive changes. He depicted Takeshi Hongo as a millionaire living in a mansion with an elderly butler called Tachibana and is haunted by the death of his parents when he was little (anyone else wondering if Ishinomori was a Batman fan?).

True it maybe created by the creator of the franchise but its considered as an alternate continuity




The original run of KR ran for five years. There were two attempts at doing "faithful" revivals, and they both ended within a couple of years. They tried a third time but stopped caring about being faithful and instead adopted the 'clean slate every year' model that had allowed both Sentai and Metal Hero to have much longer runs. We're now about to finish the 17th straight series. That suggests to me that the current model is better at fullfiling the expectations placed upon it.


I guess that makes sense though I sadly wish they should that process all over again for once.or used that 'different' process to a 'original tokusatsu franchise' than Kamen rider or super sentai.


Obligatory reminder that Super Hero Time is itself part of a programming block called "Sunday Morning Kids Time".

True.But I still it's like they are shows for 'general' audience




Yes, and that's exactly how it works out. There's that old story that when the first Taisen movie came out, there were a lot of kids who were confused because they had no idea who Decade was. As a reminder, that film came out when Fourze was airing.

That's also why these shows aren't affected much by repeating so much of their content. The vast majority of their audience are only going to watch two or three series and then move on. They're not binging on the old shows like us hardcore fans are. Also, just because of their young age those kids haven't yet seen these tropes over and over again. They still make kids excited when they experience them for the first time, so of course they'll still use them in the shows. It's only if something stops working for kids who have never seen it before that Toei will drop it.


Good point though I felt tropes are kinda repetitive.
 
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Judging from what quotes I've been reading from your posts, I simply just don't think Kamen Rider or Super Sentai is for you anymore. Maybe you should just watch something else.

To reply to lazycoconut, I know I'm regurgitating a few of my points again, but TV Asahi, Sunrise and Toei have proven twice this year that they are totally willing to axe programs that are flopping and replacing them with cheaper shows (a weekly sports update for kids, and a TV edit of a six-year old Gundam OVA). That's the thing, Super Sentai isn't just struggling right now. It is flat-out flopping. Ratings have been on a steady decline since Boukenger, but they took a nosedive with Go-Busters and will probably never recover. Go-Busters, Ninninger and Zyuohger's toy lines have all done poorly. Saban has skipped two seasons in the past five years, thus any more money Bandai could have gotten from Go-Busters and ToQger was lost. Yes, Super Sentai is an institution. But it doesn't have the ratings, or movie ticket sales, or overall cultural impact that mega franchises like Sazae-san, One Piece, Doraemon, or Pokémon still have to this day.

If Super Sentai is cancelled, I don't see there being a major outcry except from Saban (who could probably just produce similar shows instead) and older fans.
 
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Since at least 1997, people have been crying doom for Super Sentai and saying the only reason it still exists is because of PR. Do you honestly think Toei's making an entire show from scratch for the sake of Saban buying it to partially slash into his own thing? That seems like an awfully insufficient way of trying to make an extra buck.

Look, Super Sentai might not last forever, but it's foolish to think it's so disposable just because it's currently in a rut. Sentai offers something for everyone, plays on different levels, and is the only daytime hero show Japan has that appeals to boys AND girls. If Toei didn't treat Sentai like its bastard step child and Kamen Rider like it was the Golden Child, they could put in the effort to take advantage of its wide appeal and put to use certain demographics that Kamen Rider has never, or never will, intend to target. Sentai's versatile; you can do anything you want with it, while there are certain things expected from Kamen Rider.

It all just comes down to uncreativity. Toei takes Sentai for granted (just like most of the fandom tends to do). They try too hard to think what will appeal to kids rather than just putting out a product and letting kids decide for themselves what they think is cool. Sentai's not dead. Toei and Bandai's creativity is. Just look at the past 15 years of their toku. Something like Ryuki had that absurd, pulled-from-anime gimmick of card collecting, but it was treated as just a tool in that series. Nobody talked about the cards, nobody questioned why they were cards, they didn't write episodes about just the cards. There was a narrative going on, the show was trying to be about something. The cards were decoration. Compare that to Gaim or Ghost where the entire shows exist around the gimmick, the entire storylines being about the gimmick and obtaining the gimmick.

Ryuki took a gamble with the card thing. It was a risky thing, but it was something that had been proven to be successful in other properties, so -- as much as you hated it -- on the side of evil business, it made SOME sense. It's just dumb the way they approach the shows now, sitting around their offices. "What do kids like?!?! Uh...FRUIT! Yeah, how about we make a Kamen Rider about fruit?" "Great! But we can't sell special fruit, it rots! What can we sell?" "Uh...you know what kids like? PADLOCKS!" "Whoa, how did you come to that decision, weirdo? How do we make that a show?" "Ha-ha-ha-ha-ha, get out of here, voice of reason!"

Toei right now treats Sentai as just a way to make a little extra cash while Kamen Rider turns water into wine. They're not paying Sentai any attention, and THAT is the problem. It's not a matter of Sentai not doing well or not being good or whatever. It's the current way of thinking on the part of the executives. Rather than try to make something good, that will last, that will appeal to people and go on to be fondly remembered, they're only making a product that suits their needs for a year and will be done. There has been zero effort made on Toei's part, in terms of show content, since Go-busters. As they're on auto-pilot, they've just been putting out something new and shiny for the sake of something new today and move on.

And while I wouldn't want Sentai to force in stupid gimmicks like fruit padlocks for the sake of a couple more points on Bandai's fiscal charts, and I question just how much kids are even into gimmicks, maybe things wouldn't look so bleak for Sentai if they put more thought into merchandise beyond mecha. A couple of shows, like Go-onger, Boukenger and Kyoryuger, flirted with the idea of having collectible gimmicks on the side. But for the most part, Toei saves any gimmicks in Sentai for the mecha. Mecha's over, man. Nobody but the nerds likes mecha anymore. Give up just throwing a ton of mecha at Sentai and thinking that's sufficient. I think mecha's really outdated, and if there's one thing that Sentai needs to shed and find some new approach about, it's in finding something better than giant mecha to rely on. Toei mistakenly thinks Sentai's sole identifying marker is mecha. Toy sales are crap and mecha's never been duller or uglier. Coincidence?

I think the gimmicks that pertain to the heroes, and not their boring machinery, holds more interest. Kids want to pretend to be the heroes, not the heroes' vehicles. You think Kamen Rider sells more because it's cooler or that the gimmicks are good? ****, no! They rely on goddamn rings and fruit padlocks! But they sell because the gimmicks pertain to the act of being the hero. You slap that belt on, you fuss around with different dumb fruit padlocks, you make believe you're one of the Gaim Riders. If all an Astro Switch did was change the shape of Fourze's bike, nobody would want it.

Don't write off Super Sentai. In the '80s, when Kamen Rider was dead and Metal Heroes were dead before they started, who was still standing? Super Sentai. (Well before PR.) When Metal Heroes were totally flatlining, what did they do to try and survive? Become like Super Sentai. What has Kamen Rider been accused of trying to imitate, with its colorfulness and lightheartedness in the past decade? Super Sentai. Everyone's got Super Sentai envy, yet they still don't respect it.
 
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Judging from what quotes I've been reading from your posts, I simply just don't think Kamen Rider or Super Sentai is for you anymore. Maybe you should just watch something else.

It's true the reason because the kamen rider franchise now focus more on merchandising and less on storytelling unlike the past but at least amazons though its for older audience focus more on storytelling and super sentai well i feel sorry for it because its about to decline.

To reply to lazycoconut, I know I'm regurgitating a few of my points again, but TV Asahi, Sunrise and Toei have proven twice this year that they are totally willing to axe programs that are flopping and replacing them with cheaper shows (a weekly sports update for kids, and a TV edit of a six-year old Gundam OVA). That's the thing, Super Sentai isn't just struggling right now. It is flat-out flopping. Ratings have been on a steady decline since Boukenger, but they took a nosedive with Go-Busters and will probably never recover. Go-Busters, Ninninger and Zyuohger's toy lines have all done poorly. Saban has skipped two seasons in the past five years, thus any more money Bandai could have gotten from Go-Busters and ToQger was lost. Yes, Super Sentai is an institution. But it doesn't have the ratings, or movie ticket sales, or overall cultural impact that mega franchises like Sazae-san, One Piece, Doraemon, or Pokémon still have to this day.

If Super Sentai is cancelled, I don't see there being a major outcry except from Saban (who could probably just produce similar shows instead) and older fans.

Good point it seems that the super sentai franchise is about to end and we are not sure what other franchise (toku or anime) would replace that soon to be axed franchise and it seems that it would be the end of superhero time block form tv asahi .Besides nick's contract with saban is about to end and even the MMPR "reboot" movie won't save the PR franchise as well as it is about to premiere next which will be considered as a box office bomb with negative reviews.


Since at least 1997, people have been crying doom for Super Sentai and saying the only reason it still exists is because of PR. Do you honestly think Toei's making an entire show from scratch for the sake of Saban buying it to partially slash into his own thing? That seems like an awfully insufficient way of trying to make an extra buck.

Look, Super Sentai might not last forever, but it's foolish to think it's so disposable just because it's currently in a rut. Sentai offers something for everyone, plays on different levels, and is the only daytime hero show Japan has that appeals to boys AND girls. If Toei didn't treat Sentai like its bastard step child and Kamen Rider like it was the Golden Child, they could put in the effort to take advantage of its wide appeal and put to use certain demographics that Kamen Rider has never, or never will, intend to target. Sentai's versatile; you can do anything you want with it, while there are certain things expected from Kamen Rider.

It all just comes down to uncreativity. Toei takes Sentai for granted (just like most of the fandom tends to do). They try too hard to think what will appeal to kids rather than just putting out a product and letting kids decide for themselves what they think is cool. Sentai's not dead. Toei and Bandai's creativity is. Just look at the past 15 years of their toku. Something like Ryuki had that absurd, pulled-from-anime gimmick of card collecting, but it was treated as just a tool in that series. Nobody talked about the cards, nobody questioned why they were cards, they didn't write episodes about just the cards. There was a narrative going on, the show was trying to be about something. The cards were decoration. Compare that to Gaim or Ghost where the entire shows exist around the gimmick, the entire storylines being about the gimmick and obtaining the gimmick.

Ryuki took a gamble with the card thing. It was a risky thing, but it was something that had been proven to be successful in other properties, so -- as much as you hated it -- on the side of evil business, it made SOME sense. It's just dumb the way they approach the shows now, sitting around their offices. "What do kids like?!?! Uh...FRUIT! Yeah, how about we make a Kamen Rider about fruit?" "Great! But we can't sell special fruit, it rots! What can we sell?" "Uh...you know what kids like? PADLOCKS!" "Whoa, how did you come to that decision, weirdo? How do we make that a show?" "Ha-ha-ha-ha-ha, get out of here, voice of reason!"

Toei right now treats Sentai as just a way to make a little extra cash while Kamen Rider turns water into wine. They're not paying Sentai any attention, and THAT is the problem. It's not a matter of Sentai not doing well or not being good or whatever. It's the current way of thinking on the part of the executives. Rather than try to make something good, that will last, that will appeal to people and go on to be fondly remembered, they're only making a product that suits their needs for a year and will be done. There has been zero effort made on Toei's part, in terms of show content, since Go-busters. As they're on auto-pilot, they've just been putting out something new and shiny for the sake of something new today and move on.

And while I wouldn't want Sentai to force in stupid gimmicks like fruit padlocks for the sake of a couple more points on Bandai's fiscal charts, and I question just how much kids are even into gimmicks, maybe things wouldn't look so bleak for Sentai if they put more thought into merchandise beyond mecha. A couple of shows, like Go-onger, Boukenger and Kyoryuger, flirted with the idea of having collectible gimmicks on the side. But for the most part, Toei saves any gimmicks in Sentai for the mecha. Mecha's over, man. Nobody but the nerds likes mecha anymore. Give up just throwing a ton of mecha at Sentai and thinking that's sufficient. I think mecha's really outdated, and if there's one thing that Sentai needs to shed and find some new approach about, it's in finding something better than giant mecha to rely on. Toei mistakenly thinks Sentai's sole identifying marker is mecha. Toy sales are crap and mecha's never been duller or uglier. Coincidence?

I think the gimmicks that pertain to the heroes, and not their boring machinery, holds more interest. Kids want to pretend to be the heroes, not the heroes' vehicles. You think Kamen Rider sells more because it's cooler or that the gimmicks are good? ****, no! They rely on goddamn rings and fruit padlocks! But they sell because the gimmicks pertain to the act of being the hero. You slap that belt on, you fuss around with different dumb fruit padlocks, you make believe you're one of the Gaim Riders. If all an Astro Switch did was change the shape of Fourze's bike, nobody would want it.

Don't write off Super Sentai. In the '80s, when Kamen Rider was dead and Metal Heroes were dead before they started, who was still standing? Super Sentai. (Well before PR.) When Metal Heroes were totally flatlining, what did they do to try and survive? Become like Super Sentai. What has Kamen Rider been accused of trying to imitate, with its colorfulness and lightheartedness in the past decade? Super Sentai. Everyone's got Super Sentai envy, yet they still don't respect it.


You have a good point there Shougo B'Stard seems with toei focusing more on Kamen rider and less on super sentai it seems that this franchise is about to end and even power rangers is about to end as well with nick probably cancelling contracts with saban and we are not sure if netflix would revive the PR franchise like how they "US reboot" voltron with dreamworks.

And moving to the topic about what you said about ryuki,Maybe bandai and toei should have ended the kamen rider franchise with AGITO and make a new franchise that ryuki and the cards should have a fit that way those things we saw on current KR shows never happened but will be replaced by some original toku franchise with gimmicks used by the current heisei rider shows instead.And you know what i think, I think toei and bandai should have returned the KR franchise back to its roots from the early showa shows to kuuga and not to copy the concept of super sentai .Heck the ultraman franchise is always keeping its roots except that it started with a monster series called ultra Q .
 
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I know that you want Kamen Rider to go back to what it use to be, but there's no way Toei is going to kill a cash cow just because it's not being "faithful". While they're not dependent on Kamen Rider & Super Sentai, due to other projects outside of Tokusatsu, they like having them around because it's profitable. To them, it's sales first, storytelling & ratings second. Especially when they need that money to plan for next year.
 
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Good point it seems that the super sentai franchise is about to end and we are not sure what other franchise (toku or anime) would replace that soon to be axed franchise and it seems that it would be the end of superhero time block form tv asahi .Besides nick's contract with saban is about to end and even the MMPR "reboot" movie won't save the PR franchise as well as it is about to premiere next which will be considered as a box office bomb with negative reviews.

You have a good point there Shougo B'Stard seems with toei focusing more on Kamen rider and less on super sentai it seems that this franchise is about to end and even power rangers is about to end as well with nick probably cancelling contracts with saban and we are not sure if netflix would revive the PR franchise like how they "US reboot" voltron with dreamworks.

You're making a whole lot of assumptions here:

- "The franchise is about to end." No one has said that. (Someone saying "There's a good chance of Sentai being cancelled in the next five years if sales fail to improve" is NOT the same thing.) Toei, Bandai and TV-Asahi will most likely try a few more things before they think seriously about cancellation - and if they do, they'll have to take steps to make sure they don't end up in a worse position by cancelling it.
- That Toei giving Kamen Rider more attention and focus somehow proves they're about to cancel Sentai. If that were the case, Sentai would already be off the air.
- The Power Rangers movie will be a "box office bomb" with "negative reviews." It's too early to predict how the movie will perform.
- Saban will casually pull the plug on the whole PR franchise just a few years after buying it back from Disney
- Saban has already approached/would automatically approach Netflix if they don't renew their contract with Nickelodeon. That one's been doing the rounds since Samurai!

Where are you getting evidence for any of this? Do tell.

And moving to the topic about what you said about ryuki,Maybe bandai and toei should have ended the kamen rider franchise with AGITO and make a new franchise that ryuki and the cards should have a fit that way those things we saw on current KR shows never happened but will be replaced by some original toku franchise with gimmicks used by the current heisei rider shows instead.And you know what i think, I think toei and bandai should have returned the KR franchise back to its roots from the early showa shows to kuuga and not to copy the concept of super sentai .Heck the ultraman franchise is always keeping its roots except that it started with a monster series called ultra Q .

So you're saying that Toei should have ended Kamen Rider after two successful shows, missed out on a third show that was also successful (because, as Shougo has pointed out, the card "gimmick" was new in Kamen Rider and viewers liked it) and invested more money and effort in a new, completely unknown property because ... they were planning to make a show that didn't fit within your very narrow idea of what Kamen Rider should be?
 
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I know that you want Kamen Rider to go back to what it use to be, but there's no way Toei is going to kill a cash cow just because it's not being "faithful". While they're not dependent on Kamen Rider & Super Sentai, due to other projects outside of Tokusatsu, they like having them around because it's profitable. To them, it's sales first, storytelling & ratings second. Especially when they need that money to plan for next year.


Sadly true,Guess toei been on focusing on other things like every other studio does. And it's sad that both toei and bandai seems to focusing on "sales first then storytelling later" for the KR and SS franchise.I wish they should deserve a mercy killing on the bright side.The ultra franchise still keep its element though the company tsuburaya has near bankruptcy.


YSo you're saying that Toei should have ended Kamen Rider after two successful shows, missed out on a third show that was also successful (because, as Shougo has pointed out, the card "gimmick" was new in Kamen Rider and viewers liked it) and invested more money and effort in a new, completely unknown property because ... they were planning to make a show that didn't fit within your very narrow idea of what Kamen Rider should be?

Exactly because in the alternate timeline kamen rider ended with agito and a new franchise that has the elements of current heisei rider series happened



You're making a whole lot of assumptions here:

- "The franchise is about to end." No one has said that. (Someone saying "There's a good chance of Sentai being cancelled in the next five years if sales fail to improve" is NOT the same thing.) Toei, Bandai and TV-Asahi will most likely try a few more things before they think seriously about cancellation - and if they do, they'll have to take steps to make sure they don't end up in a worse position by cancelling it.
- That Toei giving Kamen Rider more attention and focus somehow proves they're about to cancel Sentai. If that were the case, Sentai would already be off the air.
- The Power Rangers movie will be a "box office bomb" with "negative reviews." It's too early to predict how the movie will perform.
- Saban will casually pull the plug on the whole PR franchise just a few years after buying it back from Disney
- Saban has already approached/would automatically approach Netflix if they don't renew their contract with Nickelodeon. That one's been doing the rounds since Samurai!

Where are you getting evidence for any of this? Do tell.



I don't have evidence for those things i can guess if those things happen and besides in the near future after ninja steel Saban will official will pull the plug on the PR franchise if the movie fails.And i think maybe there could be a chance that saban will let netflix air power rangers but in a different way at what they did with voltron with the help from dreamworks.
 
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So you're saying that Toei should have ended Kamen Rider after two successful shows, missed out on a third show that was also successful (because, as Shougo has pointed out, the card "gimmick" was new in Kamen Rider and viewers liked it) and invested more money and effort in a new, completely unknown property because ... they were planning to make a show that didn't fit within your very narrow idea of what Kamen Rider should be?
Considering that he's mentioned this...
I think toei and bandai should have returned the KR franchise back to its roots from the early showa shows to kuuga
...I'm not even sure what his idea of "what Kamen Rider should be" is. RX, Shin, ZO, J and Kuuga are all massively different from each other and what came before them.
i can guess if those things happen and besides in the near future after ninja steel Saban will official will pull the plug on the PR franchise if the movie fails.And i think maybe there could be a chance that saban will let netflix air power rangers but in a different way at what they did with voltron with the help from dreamworks.
I don't know why the success or failure of the movie would affect the TV show in any way. If the movie doesn't do well they won't make another movie. That's all. Plus I haven't heard anything to suggest nick are against re-signing the show? Your guesses are always just screaming "DOOM!" for no reason.
 
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As if there's a way for toei to sidelined the gimmick and ****, just like old times
Pfftt..
Let alone the gimmick, even the BASE suit design are already far too different than any chunk load of riders over the centuries

I mean, you barely know if it's kamen rider or some other heroes, is what I'm saying.........
In sentai, it's extremely easy to know what is THAT product that named super sentai, no matter how shitty or ridiculous suit they ever had
But in rider??? Lol
There's a lot of thing that make it a RIDER product
And yet, here we are with exaid lol



Now that i think about it, 10 year forward, if kr still runs in the future, there might not left a trace of a single thing that made kamen rider is a WHOLE THING, whether it is like no horns or mouthpiece being a real human mouth or compound eyes being a moe anime **** eyes or adding a nose..you name it
afterall it's a creativity and unique and fun and **** right???
Lol
 
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..I'm not even sure what his idea of "what Kamen Rider should be" is. RX, Shin, ZO, J and Kuuga are all massively different from each other and what came before them.
True but they are not gimmicky and merchandise like the current ones.


I don't know why the success or failure of the movie would affect the TV show in any way. If the movie doesn't do well they won't make another movie. That's all. Plus I haven't heard anything to suggest nick are against re-signing the show? Your guesses are always just screaming "DOOM!" for no reason.

Maybe.


Now that i think about it, 10 year forward, if kr still runs in the future, there might not left a trace of a single thing that made kamen rider is a WHOLE THING, whether it is like no horns or mouthpiece being a real human mouth or compound eyes being a moe anime **** eyes or adding a nose..you name it
afterall it's a creativity and unique and fun and **** right???
Lol


That's what i am afraid of and if the future kamen rider has a nose then it will be like the iron man costume who has a nose back in the 70s

Like this:

photo-oct-27-9-12-39-pm.jpg
 
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