Cho Sei Shin Series

Mihara said:

And a random question, around when would we find out about the 4th series?

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Woohoo, that's a pretty big IF there. I think if the ratings and toy sales don't follow, this could be the last of the Chouseishin series (unfortunately)

I see a lot of people having problems with the humor in Sazer-X. Well, I for one think it fits in nicely: it's not overdone, it's not too anime-esque and most of all it's typical humor you can find in any Japanese drama or movie. For example when Blaird shows up at Takuto's place asking for more natto => typical J-humor!
In contrast, I find Ryukendo's humor not fitting at all. It's like we have this giant toy commercial with every episode introducing something new we can buy, a stereotyped main story line and worst of all the humor that actually isn't all that funny but instead makes the show look like it's for 6-year olds maximum. I find that Sazer-X pulls it of way better than than Ryukendo or some of the sillier past sentais.

I know the franchise is still young and everything, but there really isn't anything that shows signs of it slowing down. I mean, we had the movie linking all three series, and so far I haven't heard of Sazer X doing bad in ratings and toy sales.

Sage Shinigami said:

A.) Do the series follow up on each other (which means I have to start at Gransazer or I'll be totally lost)?

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[hide]The series are independant of each other. Justirisers did contain several actors from GS making appearances (Mika, Akira and Naoto) with only Naoto contributing to the storyline (including him seeing Shouta/Glen as Tarious and we see him fight as himself but with a glimpse of Tawlon).[/hide]

Sage Shinigami said:

B.) If the series don't follow, which do you recommend I check out first?

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[hide]As boring as GranSazer can be at times (and with plenty of WTF moments like the marriage between Naoto and Ryouko at the end - which also is picked up in JR when Naoto shows up and is wearing a wedding ring)... As boring as GS can be it's worth watching it first so you understand a few eps in JR with Mika, Akira and Naoto showing up.

Sazer X, as far as I know, has yet to re-introduce any previous characters from either JR or GS. It would suprise me if they somehow tied the characters together as they did in JR with the GS characters showing up (Mika kicking Shouta, Shouta getting help from Naoto and Mio needing medical attention from Akira).[/hide]

Kyusaku said:

The fact that Sazer X is much more of a comedic tone is a twist from the previous 2 series, which I think is a great idea on TOHO's part. I hate how all these people want some super serious series like the crappy rider shows of today. Also it's not ultra silly either, there's great emotional conflicts with the characters as the series progresses.

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But it is (or at least, was) ultra silly. That was a big part of why I stopped watching it. The 'humour' was far too prevalent. In stuff like Magi and Deka, it's normally kept out of the action scenes and away from the villains. In Sazer X it was everywhere and the few serious moments I did get to see (e.g. Remy's moment in Ep 10) were amazingly poorly delivered.

older toku never took itself too seriously.

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I haven't seen much old toku, but none of what I have seen (assorted Sentai eps and movies and assorted Spiderman) even comes close to Sazer X. Certain movies definitely had their goofy elements, but not at Sazer X's level. And then there's the fact that people like Shougo have contended that old Toku was all frowning, all the time (apart from Changerion I think).

You really need to stop taking toku so seriously.

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Is that a specific 'you' or a general one? I haven't had numerous pointless arguments with people like Shougo and certain posters at RB if I wanted Toku to be super serious. I find serious toku boring. The light-hearted stuff is way more fun to watch but there's a limit to how much 'lightness' I can take. Magi and Deka straddled that limit quite a few times, Sazer X totally destroyed it. The thing is, I would've been able to get past it if I thought the characters were good and if the Race for the Cosmo Capsules story wasn't so cliched but it all added up to an unwatchable show.

To make my position clear (in case you skipped the above paragraph), I do not have a problem with light-hearted shows. I actually prefer them.

Mihara said:

I'd start with Sazer X, out of the three that's my favorite so far next to Riser. Sazer X is a bit more comedy heavy, but if you can like something like Magi, then you shouldn't have a problem with the comedy here.

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The opposite seems to be true really. A lot, possibly even most, of the Magi fans at RB dislike Sazer X because its humour, but a lot of the people who have expressed a dislike for Magi (like you I think, Kyusaku, Kyo, GrnPsycho by the end of it, and a few people at RB) actually like it.

It was Chou Sei Shin Gransazer that got me into toku in the first place, honestly.

It wasn't the first toku show I watched -- I'd watched MMPR back in the day, off and on up through early Turbo (first Justin, and then ditching Tommy and all the other vets just made me give up), and then watched PGSM, which I watched because it was Sailor Moon (and turned out to be really damn good Sailor Moon) -- but it was what turned me on to the medium. Since then, I've watched Justiriser, Dekaranger, Magiranger (which drove me up the wall much of the time, but intrigued me with Wolzard nonetheless, enough that I kept watching it until it stopped being annoying), Garo, and Faiz all the way through, and I'm currently watching Kabuto, Ryukendo, Black, and Hibiki, have seen what T-N has subbed of Ryuki and Kuuga, and am planning on watching Blade when I've cleared my plate a bit.

The shows I'm pointedly <em>not</em> watching are Boukenger and Sazer X.

I can't even explain why I don't like Boukenger. Just that I watched the second episode, and I suddenly actively desired to not watch a single minute more. I really wanted to like it, but no.

As for Sazer X -- it wasn't actively off-putting like Boukenger was to me, but my expectations for a Chou Sei Shin series were set so high by Gransazer and Justiriser that I found myself giving up. It's sort of like visiting a friend in Manhattan, and his roommate offering to go get pizza and then coming back with a stack of Domino's. Not only was it not what you were expecting, it's actively inferior to it, even if it's something that in another context would be quite satisfying. (I guess that's why a lot of long-time Kamen Rider fans didn't like Hibiki -- which I like a lot, because OMFG CHARACTERS I DON'T HATE (except for Kiriya).)

I guess I can say that Sazer X would be a great Super Sentai series, ef the lead character (I can't even remember his name) wasn't such a waste. Ad was the only one I could take seriously, and he didn't have so much a stick but an entire forest stuck up there.

Anyway. Gransazer and Justiriser are pretty damned cool. Check 'em out, and it'll help a bit to watch Gransazer first, just to get the cameos and the entire episode dedicated to Naoto. Justiriser is honestly a better series; it addresses most of the shortcomings of Gransazer, in being much more focused, and seeming like the writers actually had a plan for every phase of the series (unlike Gransazer, where at least it seems like the writers went "Okay, what the heck do we do now?" more than once).

Well to take a page from your own book, you've failed to spot a joke. I was exaggerating, partially poking fun at the way that you and certain others usually post. The actual matter at hand is whether or not Sazer X is reminiscent of those shows. Is it or isn't it? I'm assuming no from your post but I'd like a straight answer.

Shougo B'Stard said:

I guess you just didn't understand, if that's what you've taken from things I've said. It wasn't "all frowning," there's plenty of humor and lighthearted moments -- just not poorly written, too-stupid-for-anime "humor" as made popular by the likes of current batch of junk. What these new shows can't seem to understand is there's a million ways to have humor and lighter moments other than the form of sacrificing the character's dignity or intelligence and having everyone act like a stooge with A.D.D.

The tokusatsu of old knew what line to walk, comedy and drama was well balanced -- it's fantasy, you surely can't be 100% serious. You can't have your show be humorless, for anyone who's ever had one single stinking writing class even, you'll know the importance of humor and where and how to use it -- every story, show or movie needs light moments to help the audience breath.

The difference between humor of old and humor of new is that they didn't beat you over the head with such obvious, corny and cartoony gags, that would hardly even work in an animated form, let alone a flesh and blood actor trying to pull it off. The humor didn't come in exchange of the characters' intelligence. Older shows featured a standard humor, one I find to be much more in the style of a regular Japanese comedian, not a dumbed-down anime style.

They are superhero science-fiction shows, in the end -- fantasy. You want to be humorless and super realistic in a genre like this, you're stripping it and you'll end up with a dull, soulless piece of crap like Kamen Rider the First (or a majority of these new Riders) or the X-Men movies.

EDIT: This post once had a point, but it was lost once I had to retype it because I got booted out before sending it the first time. :laugh:

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Man, I've not heard of anyone not liking KR the First. Leave it to you to be the first one... (The X-Men movies, however, are a different story entirely. :laugh

Anyways, before this becomes a rather inane arguement thread....let's keep in mind the subject at hand is recommending a Cho Sei Shin starter series. If you guys keep this up I'll send Kamen Rider Drake over to your house and make you listen to his endless bullshit about makeup. :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:

Hah, you're right. I just realised that I'm doing something I normally hate (going into a thread about a show just to whine about it at length).

My opinion's known now so I can shut up about it. To sum up, I wouldn't recommend Sazer X, especially if the number of eps you can download/buy is still heavily limited. You might like it, but you may as well go for Gran or Justi because they're probably 'safer bets'.

Sage Shinigami said:

Man, I've not heard of anyone not liking KR the First. Leave it to you to be the first one... (The X-Men movies, however, are a different story entirely. :laugh

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I don't care for the First either, so I guess now you've heard of two. :eyebrow: For the record, I saw the rental dvd which came out a week prior to the sale dvd, so does that make the title of disliking the First, first, mine?

Barom 1 said:

I don't care for the First either, so I guess now you've heard of two. :eyebrow: For the record, I saw the rental dvd which came out a week prior to the sale dvd, so does that make the title of disliking the First, first, mine?

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I guess. Doesn't really matter to me. I've not seen the thing. I just keep hearing about how much people like it.