Analysis on Shocker and the original Kamen Rider

[Ultra Rider]

Well, wanted to refresh my memory but yeah, the villains of Riders are almost always so much more.

As far as the Yin-Yang thingie goes, I thought f that(only applies to the Ishinomori-era Riders, perhaps Kuuga...and Ryuki too?) :

Yin and Yang are the duality / binary of nature and all that in buddhism, right, with body + mind and all that? In almost every Ishinomori-Hirayama Rider show you have the ultimate villain either be the Great Leader or some form of him, with him being something ethereal, able to toss bodies like its nothing as if he's something eternal, like the spirit. It doesn't help that all of them have the exact same desire.

On the other hand, each and every time, a new Rider rises and faces a new final boss, with each and every rider being a different body, thus a different body. You can also attribute the "switching pf bodies" to the passing of ages. Yet their spirits are ultimately united by a common cause and a set of ideals that they either discover or inherit from important people in their lives.

If the Great Leader and the other villains present something spiritual, namely the ideas of evil that always come back to haunt humanity, the Riders represent the nature of humans, as in their basic insticts, of being free and just do what they want.

The most basic example I can give into this "Tyrannical Order Vs Chaotic Freedom" is Final Fantasy II which kinda explores the same theme in almost the same way...that is if Shocker had visibly affected the world by then and there had been some Kamen Riders that failed before. The heroes are kinda similar there too, with the Emperor pulling a Great Leader once in the original and twice in the remake while Firion is kind of like a simple version of Hongo(as in, he doesn't have a 600 IQ).

Or it's like in Castlevania, you always face of against Dracula, an immortal and spiritual being hellebent on rulling yet the Belmont clan that lives on through their own children so that they can always contain the threat of Dracula and keep the world free, no matter how many bodies must be lost(aka lives lost or ruined) in that fight.

It's also worth noting, that even in the Kamen Rider Spirits manga, the threat of the Great Leader is purely spiritual while Kamen Riders there exist as the failed physical vesels of the GL's spirit aka his new bodies.

 

[Khaiden]

You're mixing things up there. Yamarashiroid was originally a more important commander in the magazine stories that originated ZX, but got downplayed to a random monster in the tv special. Kamen Rider Taisen just brought him back to his original role.

Ambassador Darkness had an unused monster form, but it's unrelated to Yamaarashiroid.

Oh yes, thanks for the correction.

When I was writing this, I thought pinning everything on space aliens would be a huge cop-out when the nature of Shocker is so integral to human social issues and works so much better that way.

Then I saw Gaim with its Helheim and DJ Sagara and thought "huh, ACTUALLY..."

You know, I think being from outside earth does not necessarily mean they can't be linked to humanity's social issues.

Check out Emperor Zero from Amazon.

Ah yes, got it.

Kamen Rider Kuuga destroyed the idea of Kamen Rider being the opposition of authoritative power by lining him with police officers and making the conflict from that of nature vs. industrialization to the underlying effect of violence and the psychological damage caused by responding violence with violence, all of which Kamen Rider is built on. Not to mention form changes, and how fucked up it would be to have actual inhuman monsters killing people in a weekly to daily basis.

I agree with most of these points except the first:

1. I guess it depends on what one might see as authoritative figures. The first 2 Riders were aided by FBI agent Kazuya Taki. Whenever possible they'd help other organizations, like the short-lived anti-Shocker alliance and any of the few times police actually got involved. One of my favorite episodes (88) has Taki work as security for a peace conference, which of course gets attacked by Gel-Shocker, and Rider 1 rushes to aid the police and Taki there.
They're only anti-authority if said authority is bad, I think.

2. On the other hand, Taki himself was sort of a wild card. AFAIK he kept constant communications with the FBI and Interpol, as both were fully aware of Shocker and the Kamen Riders, but most of the time he seemed to be doing things his own way rather than following orders.
Ichijo is not exactly following protocol here, allowing Godai to do more than he should allow (though initially reluctant) and even giving him a bike intended for police use, and Godai intially didn't care about the police (as seen in the first episode when he tries to trick Ichijo so he can get into the ruins). Of course, when the entire police force discovered about this, they didn't punish Ichijo.
(Funny how in Agito it becomes full anti-authority, with anyone that did things similar to what Ichijo did facing repercussions)

He did say Great Leader is definitely human and had intended him to be human at the end, but thought it would be anti-climatic to have an old geezer at the end, so had that freaky thing at the end.

Thanks for the info, but it still doesn't answer anything. Does it?

Not important. Analysis on Shocker already covers everyone else, as they all are extentions of this very idea.

Fair enough.

The main issue with the Crisis Emperor is that, in spite of having the Great Leaders' VA, he shows no interest in the past Riders at all, only Black RX. The past Riders also don't recognize him when they spy Black RX's meeting with him in the last episode.

They don't say a word but this doesn't necessarily mean they didn't recognize him.
Of course, knowing their previous reactions to the Great Leader it does seem unfitting.

His last speech mentioned how if humanity didn't change, another Crisis Empire would appear, tying into the finale's reveal that the Kaima world was actually a twin/parallel Earth. In that sense, I guess you could look at the Crisis Empire as the worst possible path for humanity, with the Crisis Emperor as a victorious Great Leader, becoming its god and emperor, but leading the people, nature and even the planet itself to destruction. However, I don't think he was intended to be the Great Leader himself, he just was a similar character, like Golgom's Creation King, but one that also happened to share his voice actor.

Spoilers for BLACK RX and fanfic ambitions ahead:

Spoiler

My fan explanation for this is that this is a mirror version of the Great Leader. He comes from a mirror/parallel version of earth, which I assume mimicked many things from the original. I like to believe it also copied the Great Leader, and this entity is the result of that. It has everything the Great Leader had: the evil, the voice and the ambitions, but it wasn't THE Great Leader, and I like to believe this mirror Great Leader was aware of that.

Well, wanted to refresh my memory but yeah, the villains of Riders are almost always so much more.

As far as the Yin-Yang thingie goes, I thought f that(only applies to the Ishinomori-era Riders, perhaps Kuuga...and Ryuki too?) :

Yin and Yang are the duality / binary of nature and all that in buddhism, right, with body + mind and all that? In almost every Ishinomori-Hirayama Rider show you have the ultimate villain either be the Great Leader or some form of him, with him being something ethereal, able to toss bodies like its nothing as if he's something eternal, like the spirit. It doesn't help that all of them have the exact same desire.

On the other hand, each and every time, a new Rider rises and faces a new final boss, with each and every rider being a different body, thus a different body. You can also attribute the "switching pf bodies" to the passing of ages. Yet their spirits are ultimately united by a common cause and a set of ideals that they either discover or inherit from important people in their lives.

If the Great Leader and the other villains present something spiritual, namely the ideas of evil that always come back to haunt humanity, the Riders represent the nature of humans, as in their basic insticts, of being free and just do what they want.

The most basic example I can give into this "Tyrannical Order Vs Chaotic Freedom" is Final Fantasy II which kinda explores the same theme in almost the same way...that is if Shocker had visibly affected the world by then and there had been some Kamen Riders that failed before. The heroes are kinda similar there too, with the Emperor pulling a Great Leader once in the original and twice in the remake while Firion is kind of like a simple version of Hongo(as in, he doesn't have a 600 IQ).

Or it's like in Castlevania, you always face of against Dracula, an immortal and spiritual being hellebent on rulling yet the Belmont clan that lives on through their own children so that they can always contain the threat of Dracula and keep the world free, no matter how many bodies must be lost(aka lives lost or ruined) in that fight.

Wonderful examples. I was also thinking of the Legend of Zelda. It's implied it's always the same Ganon, even though there's a different Link for almost every game.

Yes, this idea of "Same evil vs different good" has been around for a while. I know I've seen even more examples.

It's also worth noting, that even in the Kamen Rider Spirits manga, the threat of the Great Leader is purely spiritual while Kamen Riders there exist as the failed physical vesels of the GL's spirit aka his new bodies.

Spoiler

Wasn't that just ZX?

 

[CannibalS]

You know, I think being from outside earth does not necessarily mean they can't be linked to humanity's social issues.

That's what I was implying. Sagara really does prove you can actually feasibly make Shocker an extraterrestial entity, if you do pretty much exactly like Helheim.

And also Ultra Rider, that's a pretty neat interpretation.

 

[Ultra Rider]

Thanks.:thumbs:

@ Khaiden : It is the same Ganon, more precisely Ganondorf. It has to do with split timelines as well etc.

[HIDE]It was somewhat implied that the previous Riders(those made by Shocker / variations of course) were used as tests towards building the basic frame of ZX's body.[/HIDE]

 

[GVman@Guts]

big ol' theory post

That was some good stuff; thanks for posting that. I really like the idea of Great Leader as this recurring manifestation of total evil, a metaphysical being that's virtually impossible to understand. It fits so well with KR.