The Toku Unpopular Opinion Thread

Toku Prime

Well-Known Member
It's like Yasuko Kobayashi really wanted to have a dark, grim and disturbing character serve as the show's main villain but she kept having to hold herself back because someone higher up (Takebe) was all like "oooh, don't do that. We don't wanna scare the little kiddies". The show tried to have Dr. Maki both ways and those comedic scenes absolutely NEVER failed to ruin the mood.
It got confirmed though that Maki wasn't originally intended to be the show's main villain. He was going to be a secondary villain ala weather dopant and Ankh was going to be the final big bad (Eiji's 'deal with the devil' finally coming to a head). Then they found out Ankh was amaaazingly popular with little kids, which forced them to have a re-think and Maki got promoted to main villain.
Ultraman Tiga is a very, VERY slow show.

Like, everything about it is very slow.

I think it's because it was the first Ultraman show they made in literal years. The action and everything is SO MUCH SLOWER in Tiga, it's really baffling.
I think it's just a side-effect of the production team trying to find their footing with Tiga. As you said, it was the first Ultraman series in many years.

That being said though, while watching Tiga I never really felt it was all that terribly slow even with taking breaks between episodes.
I don't know if it's "slower" as such (certainly not in the way that Neos was slow - good grief that was a dull mini-series). I find that when I'm watching an episode it's enjoyable enough, but when I'm done I feel no great urge to dive right into the next episode. I realise it's early days yet for me and Tiga. Hopefully at some point it'll grab hold of my interest *crosses fingers*
 

Black Fang

Active Member
You see, but Dr. Maki could have been an AMAZING villain and he legitimately was at several parts in the last few episodes of OOO. He's a psychopath who killed his older sister, completely abandoned his humanity, and was obsessed with death. I could have lived with him having the baby doll because of his psychological scars, but his overreactions whenever the baby doll was even touched were played up strictly for laughs and that, to me, instantly ruined any intimidation the character may have had going for him beforehand.

It's like Yasuko Kobayashi really wanted to have a dark, grim and disturbing character serve as the show's main villain but she kept having to hold herself back because someone higher up (Takebe) was all like "oooh, don't do that. We don't wanna scare the little kiddies". The show tried to have Dr. Maki both ways and those comedic scenes absolutely NEVER failed to ruin the mood.

Agreed. If Maki had just kept the doll in his office and talked to it like a real person and thus creeped out everyone who saw him, that would have been fine. But instead he carried the stupid thing everywhere (how does his arm not get tired) and turns into an asylum escapee whenever the doll so much as falls over.

It's not funny. It's stupid. Almost every bit of forced comedy (read: not all comedy. I know people around here love to assume criticism of comedy = "I want Inoue literature brought to the small screen.") in current Rider is stupid and, if not simply useless, actually takes away from the story and mood of the show.

It got confirmed though that Maki wasn't originally intended to be the show's main villain. He was going to be a secondary villain ala weather dopant and Ankh was going to be the final big bad (Eiji's 'deal with the devil' finally coming to a head). Then they found out Ankh was amaaazingly popular with little kids, which forced them to have a re-think and Maki got promoted to main villain.

I won't say the change was bad; it worked out adequately in the end. But the "deal with the devil" storyline has potential; another take on the "opposites as partners" theme Kobayashi had going on with Ryuki and Den-O before.

Sometimes though, I have to wonder if catering to the audience is always the right thing to do. Sure it makes sense, and I don't want to say it shouldn't be done, but if the story you have set out gets considerably affected in the process, is it worth it?

Because it's one of the only arguments people who support Kyoryuger seem to have.

See... the one thing I might say it has going for it is the continuous storytelling (which is another reason people seem to bring up always). Almost like Dairanger. But whereas one is among my favorite Sentais, the other has me questioning the sobriety of the writers and producers every five minutes.
 

Burkion

SLICE
I can overlook the changes done to OOO just due to the horrible **** going down at the time.

Does NOT make Maki a good villain by any stretch of the imagination.
 

lazycoconut

I liked him when he wasn't a god
Because it's one of the only arguments people who support Kyoryuger seem to have.

For heaven's sake, it's not a huge political thing :redface2: People don't have to stop liking something just because YOU don't!

I know people around here love to assume criticism of comedy = "I want Inoue literature brought to the small screen.")

Which reminds me of another of my "unpopular opinions": There's a difference between drama and melodrama. Nine times out of ten, Inoue and Kobayashi fall definitively into the latter.
 

Fox-Chan

Harumph.
I don't know if it's "slower" as such (certainly not in the way that Neos was slow - good grief that was a dull mini-series). I find that when I'm watching an episode it's enjoyable enough, but when I'm done I feel no great urge to dive right into the next episode. I realise it's early days yet for me and Tiga. Hopefully at some point it'll grab hold of my interest *crosses fingers*

It definitely does get better. Well, in my honest opinion at least.

As for Neos; I...really agree with you on that. I didn't think it was outright terrible, but it really wasn't worth the time I spent on it either.
 

Bigdog

New Member
I hated that guy with the doll in OOO. If he was cut out, I'd finish it. Here's the big three

For Sentai.......Gobusters was bland and felt like it ended at 11, Dairanger is nothing special and its better reading its synopsis and mythology. Sun Vulcan is kinda cool, Goggle V sucks, Bioman is boring, Goseiger was awesome in its first few [I love it even more than Megaforce] , Ohranger was a terrible first impression, Goranger sucks and JAKQ was ok. Goranger vs JAKQ was better than watching either of its series. I love Kyoryuger kind of.

For Kamen Rider.....Kamen Rider Black is a bit unbearable, Amazon devolved into Pokemon but with people by episode 3, Kamen Rider Shodai is directionless and horrible, Kuuga's filming style is like a soap opera, Ryuki is good [not as a Rider]. Faiz's melodrama pushed me away from it, Kiva is cool, Decade looks kind of awesome , OOO's first half was its own series and Fourze was watchable.

Ultraman Shodai was boring, Seven X is contrived and tries to make a show that is nothing like Ultra, Max is the second coming of Ultra-Seven, Taro is meh save in Story, Powered was like Star Trek TNG , HB's Ultraman was better than the cut of the dubbed Ultraman anime, Ace is for the lulz, Leo.....if I didn't only have the Malaysian dub to go off of...

The original Godzilla is an only one time watch, 1984 is boring, Raids Again feels redundant, and the last seven of the Showa era minus the second film series is my guilty chocolate gelato. GMK is overrated, 2000 was awesome, and the Kiryu films were better than the majority of the second series combined.

The Heisei series was like watching Power Rangers , but without the spandex.
 
For heaven's sake, it's not a huge political thing :redface2: People don't have to stop liking something just because YOU don't!

Hey, if you like Kyoryuger, I will not take that away from you. Have at it, enjoy it, different strokes for different folks and all that jazz.

But I have yet to see an argument about this show with someone who is trying to convince me the show is good NOT bring up Go-Busters as a comparison point.

toku prime said:
(certainly not in the way that Neos was slow - good grief that was a dull mini-series)

Completely agreed here. I liked Tiga a lot, and I feel it was a much MUCH better show than Neos. If Neos had lasted even half as long as Tiga did, I would have shot myself. What a bland, uninteresting, total cookie cutter Ultraman series. And yet it's still somehow not the worst '90s Ultraman series (hello, Powered).
 

kuroihikari

Member
Hey, if you like Kyoryuger, I will not take that away from you. Have at it, enjoy it, different strokes for different folks and all that jazz.

But I have yet to see an argument about this show with someone who is trying to convince me the show is good NOT bring up Go-Busters as a comparison point.

I have never brought up Go-busters once in any of the times I've discussed Kyoryuger. At least, not specifically.

Kyoryuger will be compared to recent Sentai, because that is its context, and Gobusters will eventually be brought in to the discussion. I'd personally rather compare it with the broader area of 2000s sentai like Magi, Deka and Geki and Shinkenger.
 

Toku Prime

Well-Known Member
I won't say the change was bad; it worked out adequately in the end. But the "deal with the devil" storyline has potential; another take on the "opposites as partners" theme Kobayashi had going on with Ryuki and Den-O before.

Sometimes though, I have to wonder if catering to the audience is always the right thing to do. Sure it makes sense, and I don't want to say it shouldn't be done, but if the story you have set out gets considerably affected in the process, is it worth it?
I must admit I liked the original idea just for how massive a contrast it was to the previous Rider series. In Double, two people meet under circumstances that force them to form a partnership, and their new friendship becomes their source of strength and changes them for the better. In the original vision for OOO, two people meet under circumstances that force them to form a partnership, and they find themselves completely ideologically mismatched and each promises to murder "defeat" the other as soon as he ceases to be useful to him.

As for catering to the audience, I think they did it because they were completely floored by the scale of the reaction to the character. In the 'low visibility' podcast Lynxara mentioned that the production staff received packages in the mail containing toy medal sets and accompanying notes saying "please give these to Ankh so he won't be sad anymore". They probaby convinced themselves they would be traumatising thousands of little children if they made it so that Eiji had to kill Ankh.
Amazon devolved into Pokemon but with people by episode 3
That is EXACTLY what I thought when I saw Amazon. It's also one of the main reasons why it's my least favourite out of all the Rider shows I've seen so far.
As for Neos; I...really agree with you on that. I didn't think it was outright terrible, but it really wasn't worth the time I spent on it either.
Completely agreed here. I liked Tiga a lot, and I feel it was a much MUCH better show than Neos. If Neos had lasted even half as long as Tiga did, I would have shot myself. What a bland, uninteresting, total cookie cutter Ultraman series. And yet it's still somehow not the worst '90s Ultraman series (hello, Powered).
The first three quarters of Neos might be the most boring toku I've ever seen. I could feel my life ticking away during those episodes. The final three episodes were better, but then the ending confused me - why end the series with a speech about how some day mankind will be able to use the MacGuffin when you've got a character who's currently trying to get to you as fast as he can to bring you the thing you need to use the MacGuffin??? So frustrating! It was about 6 months before I'd even consider watching something from the Ultraman franchise after that (luckily it was Mebius, which I loved).
 

Bigdog

New Member
^

1. I loved the dynamic of OOO because it felt fresher and daresay, kinda felt like MMPR in how the coins were handled. Characters are around high school age if a bit older and use power coins to fight each other. If this was a Sentai, it would be the best homage to Mighty Morphin'. Ankh's dynamic with Eiji was steps better than Hiromu was with chicken. In speaking of Gobusters, the writers had to dumb down the villains by pretending not to exploit them.

2. Ankh's relationship to Eiji kinda reminds me of the Grim Adventures of Billy and Mandy. He'll help you until the task is done and will seek to kill each other in the end. His death would be horrible, really.

3. I love Amazon, but if the kid was killed or put in his place, he wouldn't be Ash 2.0, with Amazon's Pikachu. In a way, I wish he was eliminated because it became a rut when they killed the only character that understands Amazon. Why Amazon doesn't face issues related to this is completely another issue.

4.Neos was bland as heck, and the only way it could be remotely salvaged is if it was adapted PR-style and it threw the entire plot out for one that homages the first and second series. Stopped watching after the first, and the same is with Seven X, which feels like a generic science fiction series that was dark for darknesses' sake.

5. Never seen Mebius, because I want to see 80 , if it comes out.
 

NeonZ

New Member
What is this Amazon/Pokemon comparison even supposed to mean? I don't remember any similarities aside from having a child as one of the protagonists.
 

Glamador

Member
What is this Amazon/Pokemon comparison even supposed to mean? I don't remember any similarities aside from having a child as one of the protagonists.

It isn't so much a comparison as a mockery. The insult is meant to suggest that Amazon didn't do much on his own, instead relying on Masahiko to tell him when **** was going down. And more than that, a lot of the show focused on Masahiko teaching Amazon about language and morality. "Training" him, if you will.

I think it gets blown out of proportion a bit, myself. Amazon took the initiative many times. I didn't like the series for the simpler reason that it was just plain boring. Nothing happened, **** was pulled out of the air as a solution to problems that had only existed for 5 minutes, and the central enemy presence was not only non-threatening, but seriously lacking in interesting motivation.

But disliking Amazon isn't really an unpopular opinion, I don't think.
 

Burkion

SLICE
Amazon is great, but it suffers from what I noticed V3 suffered from.

Mid season fatigue of a sort. Where things just generally get calmer and less interesting than the beginning and it's kind of paint by the numbers. The issue is, it kicked in for Amazon in the middle of its series and they didn't REALLY get over it...

Which was bad news for Stronger, which carried that fatigue into its show for the first 8 or so episodes.
 

NeonZ

New Member
Stronger's first 8 episodes are the weakest for the villain side, with little of note happening, but it's where Shigeru is at his best, IMO. He really seems like someone who can basically do anything at that point and knows and enjoys it. Afterwards, the series starts giving a lot more focus to villain in fighting, and Stronger's kind of toned down, although still with some great moments spread throughout the series.
 
Last edited:

Burkion

SLICE
The issue is, I think...

The fights kind of sucked in the first 8 episodes. There wasn't a whole lot to them. So all you had to go on was the heroes, and as great as they are, they can't hold the show up on their shoulders alone.
 

NeonZ

New Member
The battles were really one sided in those first 8 episodes, but, eh, I like Kabuto too, so I guess that kind of thing doesn't bother me if I enjoy everything else about them.
 

Black Fang

Active Member
In the 'low visibility' podcast Lynxara mentioned that the production staff received packages in the mail containing toy medal sets and accompanying notes saying "please give these to Ankh so he won't be sad anymore". They probaby convinced themselves they would be traumatising thousands of little children if they made it so that Eiji had to kill Ankh.

I don't know what to think about that. Ankh is clearly shown to not be a good guy, especially in the beginning. He's willing to let people die just for Medals. And yet kids are drawn to him? Why, because he's a floating arm and that looks funny?
 

Black Fang

Active Member
So should kids like Gai/Black Condor (at least in the beginning) because he's charming and suave? Or Sonada/Scorpio because she's nice?
 
Top